1 1 COUNTY OF HUDSON OPEN SPACE ADVISORY BOARD 2 _________________________ 3 : TRANSCRIPT MEETING OF THE COUNTY OF : OF 4 HUDSON OPEN SPACE : PROCEEDINGS ADVISORY BOARD : 5 _________________________ 6 6:30 p.m. Wednesday, June 25, 2008 7 Lincoln Park Administration Building Jersey City, New Jersey 8 9 B E F O R E: 10 JOSEPH LICCARDO, Chairperson 11 HENRY SANCHEZ, Vice-Chair THOMAS McCANN, Commissioner 12 CASSANDRA WILDAY, Commissioner PATRICIA SEBRON, Commissioner 13 JOHN BAIER, Commissioner 14 15 A L S O P R E S E N T: 16 JONATHAN LUK 17 DANIELA CIAMMARUCONI, Planning Aide 18 19 20 21 PROUT & CAMMAROTA, L.L.C. 22 CERTIFIED SHORTHAND REPORTERS 147 COLUMBIA TURNPIKE 23 FLORHAM PARK, NJ 07932 TEL: (973) 660-0600 FAX: (973) 660-1966 24 25 2 1 CERTIFICATE OF OFFICER 2 I, CAREY ANN SHAFTAN, a Certified 3 Shorthand Reporter and a Notary Public of the 4 State of New Jersey, do hereby certify that the 5 following is a true and accurate transcript of 6 the testimony as taken stenographically by me and 7 before me at the date, time and place 8 aforementioned. 9 I DO FURTHER CERTIFY that I am neither a 10 relative nor employee, nor attorney or counsel to 11 any parties involved; that I am neither related 12 to nor employed by any such attorney or counsel, 13 and that I am not financially interested in the 14 action. 15 16 _________________________________________ 17 A NOTARY PUBLIC OF THE STATE OF NEW JERSEY 18 My Commission Expires 19 May 1, 2011 20 Notary No. 2016121 21 22 23 24 25 3 1 MR. LUK: Did everybody sign in? 2 CHAIRMAN LICCARDO: Before we 3 begin with the public hearing, if you could 4 sign in. 5 If you would like to speak, you 6 don't have to, but we will pretty much call 7 you down in order and give you an opportunity 8 to speak. 9 If anyone needs any copies of 10 the handout and the draft report, that is up 11 here as well. 12 MR. LUK: The time is now 6:32 13 on my watch and we would like to begin with 14 the 2008 public hearing. 15 I have the Board members 16 available and also, just a reminder, we have a 17 transcriber here so if we could ask you to, if 18 you would like to speak, to state your name 19 and spell it and we would ask that only one 20 person speak at a time so that she can type up 21 your words. Okay? 22 And at this time I guess Mr. 23 Chairman. 24 CHAIRMAN LICCARDO: I would like 25 to welcome everybody here to the Open Space 4 1 Advisory Board and we are here basically to 2 let you know we reviewed everything, the draft 3 recommendations that are going to be sent in, 4 and right now if anybody wants to say anything 5 or speak, now is your opportunity. 6 Sarah Muccifori. 7 MS. MUCCIFORI: Sara Muccifori, 8 M-U-C-C-I-F-O-R-I. I am from Save Ellis 9 Island. 10 Save Ellis Island would like to 11 thank the Board for the recommendation you 12 made for helping us finish the first floor of 13 the Laundry/Hospital Out building on Ellis 14 Island. 15 The grant is very important as 16 we are starting construction next week and we 17 do not have all the funds in place, so we are 18 certainly hopeful that everything will go 19 smoothly with this and we thank you for 20 consideration. 21 Also for your past help with our 22 Ellis Island Restorations and we hope that 23 Ellis Island continues and will continue to be 24 helpful to Hudson County through increasing 25 tourists visitation and with our increasing 5 1 education programs for teachers and students 2 and the general public. 3 CHAIRMAN LICCARDO: John 4 Flannery. 5 Charlene Burke. 6 MS. BURKE: Charlene Burke 7 B-U-R-K-E. 8 As you know I am president of 9 West Bergen Lincoln Park -- West Bergen and 10 Lincoln Park Neighborhood Coalition of which I 11 am the president and that is the residential 12 area just outside of Lincoln Park. 13 Within our district is Boyd 14 McGuiness Park which we were speaking of the 15 expansion by acquiring property next to it and 16 recommend the request that the Town of Jersey 17 City made 100 percent, and I thank you very 18 much for that because that will be an 19 incredible addition to our neighborhood that 20 is lacking in so many amenities in terms of 21 parks other than what Lincoln Park offers, so 22 I thank you very much and I would like you all 23 to know I probably will be back again next 24 year as we develop the property once we 25 acquire it, but thank you all for your 6 1 consideration and recommendation. 2 CHAIRMAN LICCARDO: Frances 3 Murgittroy. 4 MS. MURGITTROY: Frances 5 Murgittroy. 6 While we didn't get everything 7 we asked for, we looked at our project as a 8 multiple phase project and at least have 9 gotten it started, so we would like to thank 10 you for your consideration and hopefully we 11 will come back for more later. 12 CHAIRMAN LICCARDO: Bob 13 Yannazzo. 14 MR. YANNAZZO: Robert Yannazzo, 15 Y-A-N-N-A-Z-Z-O. 16 I am the chief architect for 17 Hudson County as you all know, and I came here 18 tonight to thank the Board for the $250,000 19 additional. 20 This will be of great help to us 21 in doing Phase Two of the Lighting 22 Restoration. 23 Last week we received the 24 letters from local government services 25 allowing us to take prequalification of 7 1 contractors, so by the coming month, July, we 2 should have that out on the street for 3 prequalified contractors. 4 Those that are deemed 5 prequalified will get the contract documents 6 and we will start Phase Two, or at least bid 7 Phase Two, and hopefully I would like to try 8 to award by the August Board of Freeholders 9 meeting if not at least the first meeting in 10 September and start the Phase Two of the 11 Lighting Restoration. 12 We are just wrapping up Phase 13 One. We have been trying to get final 14 department approval from Jersey City on the 15 upgrading of the electrical and their input on 16 it and we will be able to close that out. 17 So again, this will be greatly 18 appreciated by the project. While it isn't 19 what I asked for, again, anything will help us 20 to complete this. 21 And I know we are anxious to get 22 started and it really is of great help. Thank 23 you again. 24 CHAIRMAN LICCARDO: Mayor 25 Hannon. 8 1 MAYOR HANNON: Mayor James 2 Hannon from Guttenberg. 3 I would like to thank you for 4 all the assistance you have given to the town 5 and hopefully you can continue to do so, thank 6 you. 7 MR. DRASHEFF: Just echo what 8 the Mayor said, we appreciate what we get from 9 Open Space. We are committed to this project 10 in Guttenberg. 11 We actually are in the process 12 of doing our final contract drawings. Our 13 application is in with the DEP and if we have 14 any luck you will be invited to a ribbon 15 cutting before the end of the year. 16 CHAIRMAN LICCARDO: Ann 17 Holtzman. 18 MS. HOLTZMAN: Ann Holtzman, 19 H-O-L-T-Z-M-A-N, representing Hoboken 20 Southwest Park. 21 I want to thank you for your 22 consideration. This is the first application 23 that we have made in conjunction with the city 24 counsel of the City of Hoboken and I just, you 25 know, we were really excited the day that we 9 1 came and did the presentation because we got 2 very high praise that we had put together such 3 a great application, actually, and had done -- 4 were commended on having made the best 5 presentation this year. And obviously our 6 competitive scores put us second highest in 7 the rankings of those applications for 8 acquisition money. 9 However, obviously when -- we 10 got bumped from consideration. I understand 11 because as it was stated in the minutes, 12 because we had not completed our appraisals 13 yet, and I just wanted a little bit of 14 clarification for us so as we go forward and 15 make other applications that we understand 16 exactly what the situation is. 17 In the application itself it 18 states that the appraisals have to be prepared 19 and ready prior to the distribution of funds, 20 and I had spoken to Jonathan prior to 21 submitting our application to make sure that 22 that was the case because obviously this works 23 very slowly sometimes in getting these things 24 accomplished, and to that point we actually 25 submitted copies of the RFQ that the City had 10 1 issued for appraisal services and a copy of a 2 planning document that had appraisal 3 information on it even though it was not an 4 official appraisal. 5 Just to show you -- just to 6 demonstrate that we were on the track to 7 actually complete those, I just wanted -- I 8 can share with you a couple of other pieces of 9 paper just for your records. 10 The City has -- the City has 11 actually designated an appraisal service 12 company that they will be executing the 13 contracts for at the July 2nd meeting. Just 14 waiting for the contracts to be prepared. And 15 those appraisals will be done by the 15th of 16 August. 17 And there are also two other 18 documents there, one is a resolution from the 19 council authorizing the Mayor to be in contact 20 with a trust for public land to start 21 negotiations with owners of property in the, 22 in the zone where we are planning the park and 23 the other one is a zoning change document that 24 we have -- that has been put together that 25 will actually add the open space designation 11 1 to our zoning ordinance for the City so we can 2 actually identify and designate spaces that 3 are existing park space within the City of 4 Hoboken and park space that is, that is 5 identified by the master plan so that those 6 parcels can actually be protected for future 7 use. 8 So basically I am here today to 9 ask you under the circumstances to reconsider 10 your distribution. 11 Obviously we are very much in 12 support of your decision to fund the Cognis 13 site as well, but obviously there is just as 14 much an urgency to start acquisition on both 15 parcels, not just the one. 16 Thank you. 17 CHAIRMAN LICCARDO: Thank you. 18 Jim Kocis. 19 MR. KOCIS: Jim Kocis speaking 20 on behalf of the Cognis Site Land Acquisition 21 which is a grassroots organization in Hoboken. 22 I would like to thank you for 23 your hard work and your consideration of all 24 of the proposals. 25 Like Ann, I am grateful for the 12 1 recognition that the Cognis site has received. 2 It is a site that is ready for, to add to 3 Hoboken's open space. It is a great site and 4 I think you chose well and, like Ann, I am 5 also a little disappointed we are not further 6 along with Southwest Parks and I would like to 7 throw my support for what she said as well. 8 K-O-C-I-S. 9 CHAIRMAN LICCARDO: Lynn 10 Bajardi. 11 MS. BAJARDI: Lynn Bajardi, 12 B-A-J-A-R-D-I. 13 Thank you, members of the Board, 14 for your consideration on this. I wasn't here 15 to see the presentation made by Ann Holtzman 16 concerning the Hoboken Southwest Parks 17 Coalition's request for funding for the 18 Southwest 6 area, but I heard a lot of good 19 things about the reaction from the Board and 20 from the professionals who advised the Board 21 about the presentation that was made. 22 So, along with others, I was 23 quite shocked and disappointed to see, despite 24 its high score, it was wiped from the top 25 rather quickly, apparently, according to the 13 1 minutes of your meeting on the issue of 2 whether or not an appraisal was immediately 3 available at that time when in fact the 4 process was well underway to get an appraisal 5 on that site. 6 The application apparently 7 states that an appraisal prepared in 8 accordance with DEP Green Acres was prepared 9 to execute a grant agreement but the question 10 was asked and apparently answered that the 11 appraisal could be completed after the 12 application date but would be required prior 13 to the distribution of the funding in 14 August/September. 15 So I guess one of the questions 16 is what is the actual policy of this Board. 17 Is it as simple as to say without an 18 acquisition appraisal in hand with an 19 application you are automatically disqualified 20 from any further conversation in trying to 21 apply for funding and, if so, that needs to be 22 made very clear and up front sooner than the 23 actual session that the Board votes on it. 24 And I suggest there appears to 25 be some misunderstanding about that. The 14 1 Board I suggest would be wise to make that 2 clear. 3 At this point in looking at the 4 project scores which appear on the project 5 scores summary, Southwest Park actually came 6 in second ahead of other land acquisition 7 items that are actually to receive the funding 8 here, and I would add the scores of those that 9 are receiving funding are lower than 10 apparently previous year's applications that I 11 have seen on the website which indicate much 12 higher scores, higher even than the PJP/Siegel 13 Property acquisition which are apparently not 14 going to be getting any money here despite the 15 scores that they received. 16 And I did not look at the 17 Historic Preservation ones, but it appears the 18 top score there is getting money as was 19 mentioned here. 20 Once again, to demonstrate the 21 clear intent to complete the appraisals, it 22 was included in the copy of the RFQ, the legal 23 notices already had been published, documents 24 are on hand, the city council of the City of 25 Hoboken is moving forward with this process. 15 1 It is also a subject of a great 2 deal of conversation and has been for several 3 years now and is not something that came out 4 of nowhere but is something that grew out of 5 the master plan that was developed some years 6 ago and finally getting to the point where the 7 opportunity arises to create this park and I 8 would create this park in a very diverse part 9 of the City of Hoboken which is something that 10 I think should be considered when putting the 11 applications together as well. 12 You received a copy of the city 13 council's resolution forwarded with this. 14 There was also a question in the 15 minutes of the meeting that were received via 16 the Open Public Records Act that a member of 17 the Board who apparently wasn't listed as 18 being in attendance in those minutes actually 19 made the motion to eliminate this application 20 as well as the PJP application from 21 consideration due to the fact that no 22 appraisals were submitted and the quote in 23 that was they were not project ready but the 24 person was not listed as attending the meeting 25 at the time. 16 1 I am curious whether that was an 2 error in the attendance record or the record 3 of who actually made that motion and would 4 seek to correct the record and correct the 5 minutes to make that determination clear. 6 As well, there is also a 7 question in those minutes as to how much money 8 is actually going to be received for the site. 9 It anticipates 3.5 million, but other 10 paperwork says 3 million, so perhaps your 11 minutes are incorrect on that, as well. 12 In summary, I would just like to 13 ask the Board to reconsider its decision to 14 eliminate high scoring applications on the 15 basis of the question of appraisals not being 16 immediately available. These appraisals, 17 especially in a real estate market like we are 18 in today, tend to change. Those that may have 19 been received three or five years ago that may 20 be accepted by this Board may not in fact even 21 be proper and accurate. 22 And appraisals should also 23 include the cost of cleanups of these sites if 24 they are similar, if they are of industrial 25 nature, and will actually cost much more to 17 1 remediate than simply the acquisition for that 2 land. 3 So the bottom line, I ask you to 4 reconsider funding for the Southwest Park Land 5 Acquisition and also take a closer look at or 6 at least make clear what the policy is 7 concerning appraisal documents and their 8 necessity in relation to these applications 9 and it would help the people making the 10 applications save a lot of time if it was 11 aware exactly what the deadline was for the 12 things that are necessary. 13 Thank you. 14 CHAIRMAN LICCARDO: Thank you. 15 MR. LUK: If I could just check 16 one more time if there is anyone that did not 17 sign in or wished to speak further, to do so 18 now. 19 CHAIRMAN LICCARDO: Nobody else 20 has anymore questions? 21 Anybody on the Board have 22 comments? 23 I think that's basically the 24 conclusion of this meeting. I would like to 25 thank everybody for coming. 18 1 MR. LUK: If I could, before we 2 conclude I just want to remind the audience in 3 attendance today this is purely a public 4 hearing. This is your opportunity to provide 5 your comments to the Advisory Board regarding 6 the recommendations report, so all your 7 questions will be considered and addressed at 8 a later time, not during the public hearing. 9 CHAIRMAN LICCARDO: Yes. 10 MS. BURKE: When will this be 11 appearing in front of the Freeholders? 12 MR. LUK: The schedule is for 13 the report to be submitted to the County 14 Executive and at that time, according to the 15 program policy guidelines, the County 16 Executive will review the recommendations and 17 it's up to the County Executive and the 18 administration to decide when to submit it to 19 the Freeholders, but generally the past years 20 this has been before the Freeholder Board in 21 the August meeting. 22 CHAIRMAN LICCARDO: Thank you 23 very much. 24 COMMISSIONER SANCHEZ: I make a 25 motion the session now be closed. 19 1 COMMISSIONER McCANN: I second 2 it. 3 CHAIRMAN LICCARDO: All in 4 favor? 5 (Round of Ayes.) 6 (Time noted: 6:55 p.m.) 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25