1 1 COUNTY OF HUDSON PLANNING BOARD 2 _________________________ 3 : TRANSCRIPT MEETING OF THE COUNTY OF : OF 4 HUDSON PLANNING BOARD : PROCEEDINGS _________________________ 5 6:30 p.m. 6 Wednesday, April 16, 2008 567 Pavonia Avenue 7 Jersey City, New Jersey 8 B E F O R E: 9 JUDE FITZGIBBONS, Chairperson RENEE BETTINGER, Commissioner 10 DANIEL CHOFFO, Commissioner DOREEN DiDOMENICO, Commissioner 11 MICHAEL HOLLOWAY, COMMISSIONER RUSHABH MEHTA, COMMISSIONER 12 JOSE MUNOZ, COMMISSIONER KENNEDY NG, COMMISSIONER 13 14 A L S O P R E S E N T: 15 THOMAS P. CALVANICO, ESQ. Board Attorney 16 STEPHEN MARKS, PP, AICP 17 Planning Director 18 MARIO TRIDENTE, Development and Zoning 19 Compliance Official 20 21 PROUT & CAMMAROTA, L.L.C. 22 CERTIFIED SHORTHAND REPORTERS 147 COLUMBIA TURNPIKE 23 FLORHAM PARK, NJ 07932 TEL: (973) 660-0600 FAX: (973) 660-1966 24 25 2 1 CERTIFICATE OF OFFICER 2 I, CAREY ANN SHAFTAN, a Certified 3 Shorthand Reporter and a Notary Public of the 4 State of New Jersey, do hereby certify that prior 5 to the commencement of the examination, the 6 witness was duly sworn by me. 7 I DO FURTHER CERTIFY that the following 8 is a true and accurate transcript of the 9 testimony as taken stenographically by me and 10 before me at the date, time and place 11 aforementioned. 12 I DO FURTHER CERTIFY that I am neither a 13 relative nor employee, nor attorney or counsel to 14 any parties involved; that I am neither related 15 to nor employed by any such attorney or counsel, 16 and that I am not financially interested in the 17 action. 18 19 _________________________________________ 20 A NOTARY PUBLIC OF THE STATE OF NEW JERSEY 21 My Commission Expires 22 May 1, 2011 23 Notary No. 2016121 24 25 3 1 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Good 2 evening. I am about to open and call to order 3 the regular meeting for the Hudson County 4 Planning Board for April 16, 2008. 5 Has this -- Counselor, has this 6 meeting been properly advertised? 7 ATTORNEY CALVANICO: Yes, Mr. 8 Chairman, the meeting has been properly 9 advertised in accordance with the New Jersey 10 Open Public Meetings Act and has been posted 11 and the bulletin board of bothe the County 12 Clerk and the Board of Chosen Freeholders, and 13 published in the Jersey Journal 14 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Mr. 15 Secretary, can I have a roll call. 16 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 17 Arencibia? 18 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: Here. 19 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 20 Avagliano? 21 Not here. 22 Commissioner Bettinger? 23 COMMISSIONER BETTINGER: Here. 24 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 25 Choffo? 4 1 COMMISSIONER CHOFFO: Here. 2 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 3 DiDomenico? 4 No response. 5 Commissioner Holloway? 6 COMMISSIONER HOLLOWAY: Here. 7 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 8 Mehta? 9 COMMISSIONER MEHTA: Here. 10 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 11 Munoz? 12 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: Here. 13 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commission Ng? 14 COMMISSIONER NG: Here. 15 DIRECTOR MARKS: Chairman 16 Fitzgibbons? 17 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Present. 18 DIRECTOR MARKS: Mr. Chairman, 19 we have a quorum. 20 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Will 21 everyone rise to salute the flag. 22 (All rise to salute the Flag.) 23 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: I want to 24 welcome everyone here. 25 Please, when you address the 5 1 podium give your name in full and please, if 2 you can, turn all cell phones off. 3 We have a long agenda tonight 4 and we want to get things going really fast 5 here. 6 Do we have a motion to accept 7 the minutes from the last meeting? 8 COMMISSIONER CHOFFO: I will 9 make a motion. 10 COMMISSIONER HOLLOWAY: Second. 11 DIRECTOR MARKS: Mr. Chairman, 12 on a motion to accept the minutes made by 13 Commissioner Choffo and seconded by 14 Commissioner Holloway, Commissioner 15 Arencibia? 16 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: Aye. 17 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 18 Bettinger? 19 COMMISSIONER BETTINGER: Aye. 20 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 21 Choffo? 22 COMMISSIONER CHOFFO: Aye. 23 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 24 Holloway? 25 COMMISSIONER HOLLOWAY: Aye. 6 1 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 2 Mehta? 3 COMMISSIONER MEHTA: Here. 4 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 5 Munoz? 6 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: I abstain. 7 I wasn't present at the last meeting, Mr. 8 Chairman. 9 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 10 Ng? 11 COMMISSIONER NG: Aye. 12 DIRECTOR MARKS: Chairman 13 Fitzgibbons? 14 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Yes. 15 DIRECTOR MARKS: The motion 16 passes. 17 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Do we 18 have anybody from the public that wishes to 19 speak? 20 Seeing none, I move the meeting 21 ahead. 22 Tonight we have an introduction 23 of the Hudson County Planning Board, re-exam 24 report. 25 DIRECTOR MARKS: Yes, sir. We 7 1 have Jeff Perlman from the firm of Hyer, Gruel 2 & Associates. 3 Just for background information, 4 for the last six months the firm of Hyer, 5 Gruel & Associates has been preparing a master 6 plan re-examination report and coming out to 7 the monthly site plan subdivision review 8 committee meetings. 9 It would be basically an update 10 and an addendum to the current 2002 Hudson 11 County Master Plan. 12 Mr. Perlman is here to make his 13 presentation. Distributed this evening is a 14 copy of the report and at the conclusion of 15 Mr. Perlman's presentation, if the Board could 16 introduce it officially then I propose that 17 the county establish a 60 day public comment 18 period. 19 My office will send it out to 20 all the municipalities for public comment to 21 make it available through the internet and 22 have an official copy in our office for public 23 inspection and have a public hearing at our, 24 during our June monthly meeting. 25 Mr. Perlman. 8 1 MR. PERLMAN: As Steven said, my 2 name is Jeff Perlman. I am an associate at 3 the planning firm of Heyer, Gruel & Associates 4 and I think what I did was you should have a 5 copy of a draft form of the re-examination 6 report and it is a draft and we are looking 7 for your comments. 8 We definitely assume there will 9 be some changes and that we would come back 10 with a more lengthy and more detailed 11 presentation of the master plan. 12 We want to get -- sort of 13 highlight you on some of the things that, with 14 the direction of Steve Marks and the site plan 15 and subdivision review subcommittee have been 16 giving us great direction on how to move 17 forward and build upon the good work that was 18 done in the 2002 county master plan. 19 So I have with me this evening a 20 number of maps that I will be referring to 21 briefly as we move through the report. 22 This is just to highlight some 23 of the things that we, some of our findings as 24 we went through the process. 25 Basically we tried to do 9 1 something different, take a different approach 2 in doing a re-examination report because in 3 fact there really isn't any state statutes 4 defining how a county does or goes about doing 5 a re-examination report. 6 Usually that is related to the 7 municipalities and there is a list of state 8 statutes or criteria that a municipality must 9 meet, but in the county you have more of a 10 freedom to really take on more of a holistic 11 approach. 12 So what we tried to do was 13 really step back and take into account all of 14 the great planning work that has been done by 15 the county since 2002. 16 The open space master plans, the 17 economic development strategies that, the SEDS 18 report for 2007, I believe. 19 Some recent planning documents, 20 try to tie those in together particularly as 21 it relates to transit improvements, second 22 circle mobility, a number of these planning 23 documents and try to weave them together, 24 tying them to land use, circulation and 25 particularly as relates to the environment as 10 1 relates to drainage. 2 And climate change actually is 3 something that we really took a look at 4 because, as you may be aware, there have been 5 a number of reports from the international 6 community from scientists talking about the 7 impact of climate change throughout the United 8 States, throughout the world, and also there 9 are some reports focusing on the United States 10 and particularly along the east coast and in 11 the New York Hudson region. 12 So I wanted to highlight for you 13 some of those findings and some of our 14 recommendations how to begin to address that, 15 tying in all of the other elements of planning 16 that a municipality or county or state does. 17 So, without further ado, 18 basically we have the report is broken up into 19 seven or eight chapters. 20 We looked at the goals from 2002 21 and we added a number of goals and objectives 22 in the master plan as it related to drainage, 23 as it relates to storm water management, as it 24 relates to circulation and economic 25 development, and you could see them in the 11 1 report here if you go through them. 2 There are -- there are many, 3 many goals in each different chapter so I am 4 not really going to go through them in detail, 5 but we do have all that in the plans, making 6 circulation, bicycle and pedestrians 7 improvements, improvements to the green 8 infrastructure to form water management, to 9 controlling nonsource pollution of storm water 10 runoff and try to reduce the combined sewer 11 overflows that this county has experienced 12 over the years, to reduce the flooding and 13 potential for flooding in this area. 14 So what I want to do is in terms 15 of focusing on some areas, I want to talk 16 about the conservation or the climate change 17 and a couple of maps here to show you what we 18 are talking about. 19 ATTORNEY CALVANICO: Before you 20 begin, if you are going to be testifying I 21 would like to swear you in for the record. 22 State your name spell your last 23 name. 24 MR. PERLMAN: Jeffrey Perlman, 25 P-E-R-L-M-A-N. 12 1 (Jeffrey Perlman was duly 2 sworn.) 3 MR. PERLMAN: So one of the 4 things we found in terms of looking at some of 5 the goals I mentioned, climate change, 6 improving dealing with climate change and 7 improving drainage and storm water as we 8 looked at the parts of the county. 9 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Can you 10 raise that up on the easel? 11 MR. PERLMAN: I will. Let's go 12 with this first, actually. 13 DIRECTOR MARKS: Could you also 14 identify the maps for the record that you are 15 pointing out to. 16 MR. PERLMAN: Absolutely. 17 So this is an elevations map and 18 it is in the conservation chapter, and if I 19 find it I could tell you exactly what page 20 it's on. Give me a moment. 21 DIRECTOR MARKS: Page 81? 22 MR. PERLMAN: It might be 81. 23 Actually 82. My version is Page 82. 24 And basically this is an 25 elevations map of the county and you can see 13 1 here obviously anything in red is water. 2 Anything in orange is from zero 3 feet to ten feet. And then as you go, darker 4 colors is higher elevation. 5 So Palisades Park and the ridge 6 part of the county is above 40 feet, but you 7 can see that the good part of the county is 8 between 0 feet and ten feet and a number of 9 reports came out from the international panel 10 of claimant change. 11 Members of scientists did an 12 associate risk of climate change on the 13 county, well in the New York region, but 14 included, but being that the county and New 15 York City basically share the Hudson River, 16 any impacts that impact Manhattan are likely 17 to impact Hudson County. 18 So what they talked about was if 19 we don't get climate emissions under control, 20 the areas that are low lying, areas that are 21 currently in a, in a flood hazard area, in a 22 flood plain, the chances of flooding would 23 increase. 24 So those areas that are in the 25 flood plain according to FEMA generally may 14 1 have a one percent chance of flooding or 100 2 year storm event, if you are more familiar 3 with that. 4 That in a high -- if we don't 5 keep emissions under control those kind of 6 storm events might be happening every eleven 7 years. Every eleven years to every 200 years. 8 So those storm events would 9 happen more frequently and those areas that 10 are generally not susceptible to flood would 11 become susceptible to floods because of rising 12 sea levels and so forth. 13 Definitely recommend that the 14 county work with the State and really 15 calculate its Co2 emissions, sort of doing a 16 whole sustainability plan going forward 17 looking at your Co2 emissions of the county 18 going down to a municipal level and where 19 those emissions are. 20 Stationary sources, how much of 21 that is for homes, how much for commercial, 22 how much is related transportation and when 23 you are making your, making plans and 24 improvements to circulation to transit, it 25 will help you to decide where to put comments 15 1 to reduce your Co2 emissions. 2 And also we recommend an area, a 3 mapping of all the energy infrastructure, the 4 power plants sites for renewable energy, sort 5 of getting a chance to see where sites may be 6 available for development and we do know that 7 the Meadowlands are working on that in their 8 district. 9 But we did want to highlight 10 that that particularly is a problem, and I 11 don't want to get anybody upset, but this is a 12 flood hazard map and for illustrative purposes 13 only. 14 So if you are concerned that 15 your home is in a green area, you should be. 16 This is just for illustrative purposes. 17 This is on Page 81 and this 18 talks about those areas that are on the flood 19 hazard map and generally speaking a decent 20 part of the county, that is what is heavily 21 populated, is in the flood hazard map or the 22 area that is susceptible to one percent 23 flooding or the hundred year storm event. 24 And see these areas would be 25 most except susceptible to climate change. If 16 1 the sea levels rose storms became more 2 intense, these areas would have a likelihood 3 of flooding more frequently. 4 And previous storms that 5 happened the last decade or so disrupted 6 transportation into Manhattan, so the towns 7 got flooded and so forth, and so the economic 8 hit for something like that would be, could be 9 potentially be pretty big, so it is, it makes 10 sense from the county to start to look at this 11 issue and address it head on. 12 That is one aspect of the plan. 13 The other major aspect was looking at 14 drainage. 15 Similar, it is related, but it 16 is to talk about how do we address very 17 heavily urbanized area, Hudson County, and how 18 do we bring in, how do we treat storm water. 19 How do we hold it, reduce the runoff into 20 streams, streets, that cause flooding. 21 And what we have recommended is 22 really rethinking how we view storm water 23 management and implementing a number of low 24 impact development techniques and this is the 25 recommendations that would serve to, when the 17 1 county redoes its site plan and subdivision 2 ordinance, that it would make standards and 3 create standards for this. 4 But to, just to relook at how 5 you deal with storm water, using street trees 6 and just as reducing heat factors which is 7 important for street trees to provide 8 amenities for pedestrians and so forth, it 9 actually can be used to actually capture the 10 storm water, hold it, purify it and slow the 11 rate of runoff into the streams and into the 12 storm sewer system. And if you slow that 13 speed, then the number or the events of 14 combined sewer overflows would be reduced. 15 So we looked at how to treat 16 street trees and a tree to could absorb 17 hundreds of gallons of water in a rain event 18 and that alone, if there are enough trees that 19 were planted as part of as developers come in, 20 as applicants come in for development to 21 require that they plant trees along the street 22 and that they are done in a way that is, the 23 tree can stay alive, that it can grow and 24 capture storm water, then you can reduce the 25 potential impacts of rain events and flooding 18 1 and that was another major recommendation that 2 we made. 3 And we also in general looked at 4 how to improve circulation, how to improve 5 mass transit, and the way we looked at that, 6 we said the county is already making major 7 steps to improve mass transit and what we 8 looked at was how to weave together all those 9 improvements dealing with climate change and 10 reviewing the streetscape in terms of street 11 planting and so forth to encourage multi 12 mobile transportation, improve walking and 13 cycling as a means of transportation to get to 14 and from your place of work or shopping and so 15 forth and so we have, made recommendations 16 that the site plan and subdivision ordinance 17 be reviewed that when an applicant comes in, 18 that they not only give you a traffic report 19 as to the level of service for a particular 20 road, but also take into account, well, where 21 -- how many pedestrians might this project 22 generate, how many cyclists might this project 23 generate and provided infrastructure to 24 accommodate that. 25 So that you have -- you would 19 1 encourage more people to walk and to cycle to 2 work. That is another aspect we looked at and 3 made recommendations of the plan. 4 We also looked at and mapped and 5 if I have it here I will show you, means to 6 improve access to recreation and this was, I 7 will show you a map and I will tell you what 8 page it is on. This is the last few matches. 9 This would be if the county 10 implemented all of its -- here is a map and it 11 is on, it is on Page 73. 12 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Page 74. 13 MR. PERLMAN: Basically this is 14 a map of all the proposed, all the existing 15 and proposed parks and trails and a five 16 minute walk to those parks and trails and what 17 you see is the county, if all the proposed 18 parks and trails are implemented, a good 19 amount of the county is, a good amount of the 20 population of the county is within a five 21 minute walk to either a park or a trail and 22 that is really impressive and the county 23 should be proud of its planning in that 24 regard. 25 I want to show once you built 20 1 everything out there will be, except for some 2 small areas, you would have people within five 3 minutes of a park or trail and that tying all 4 these in together is an additional amenity 5 that promotes, improves the quality of life 6 and this is also a place where connecting from 7 one to another through street trees, through 8 reimaging the streets as part of a public 9 space, these trails and these parks could be 10 weaved in together to provide a really 11 unbroken network and that alone would really 12 increase the livability and improve the 13 livability of the county and the people that 14 live within it. 15 We have a number of 16 recommendations in materials of how the county 17 can move about improving the rest of the 18 improvements here and again a lot of what we 19 did in this particular chapter was pulling all 20 the other plans together and putting them 21 together and showing to the county here is 22 what you have been doing over the last six 23 years in trying to fill out your park and 24 trail space, so I think when you see it in 25 this regard it is very impressive. 21 1 I think that is most of my 2 highlight. Questions. 3 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: I want to 4 thank you for your presentation and before we 5 move it we are going to make a motion to 6 present it. 7 DIRECTOR MARKS: Mr. Chairman, 8 on a motion to introduce it and then to 9 establish a 60 day public comment period 10 followed by a public hearing in June and then 11 we would revisit it based on the comments that 12 we receive and sometime in either July or 13 August I would ask the Board to recommend it 14 to the full Board of Chosen Freeholders. 15 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: I like 16 the idea but it takes a lot of work from all 17 municipalities, the State government plus the 18 Federal government and the Port Authority to 19 make this thing work so it takes all those 20 agencies to work together too, because 21 especially where I come, Hoboken, it is 22 flooded already. 23 You don't need to wait for 100 24 year storm. The downtown is -- 25 MR. PERLMAN: I understand. 22 1 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Actually 2 parts of Jersey City are the same way. But if 3 all the agencies work together in a joint 4 effort, I think it is possible. 5 But if the State or Federal or 6 municipalities in the county don't work 7 together, that is a project for the future and 8 I like the idea, you know? 9 If anybody else has, on the 10 Board wants to say anything. 11 Do we -- can we introduce it? 12 DIRECTOR MARKS: Is there a 13 motion to introduce? 14 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: I will make 15 a motion. 16 COMMISSIONER BETTINGER: I will 17 second the motion. 18 DIRECTOR MARKS: Mr. Chairman, 19 on a motion to introduce the draft master plan 20 re-examination report made by Commissioner 21 Munoz and seconded by Commissioner Bettinger, 22 Commissioner Arencibia? 23 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: Aye. 24 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 25 Bettinger? 23 1 COMMISSIONER BETTINGER: Aye. 2 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 3 Choffo? 4 COMMISSIONER CHOFFO: Aye. 5 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 6 DiDomenico? 7 COMMISSIONER DIDOMENICO: Aye. 8 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 9 Holloway? 10 COMMISSIONER HOLLOWAY: Aye. 11 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 12 Mehta? 13 COMMISSIONER MEHTA: Aye. 14 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 15 Munoz? 16 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: Aye. 17 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 18 Ng? 19 COMMISSIONER NG: Aye. 20 DIRECTOR MARKS: Chairman 21 Fitzgibbons? 22 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Aye. 23 DIRECTOR MARKS: Mr. Chairman, 24 the motion passed. 25 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: 24 1 Resolutions to be approved. 2 DIRECTOR MARKS: 6A on the 3 agenda, memorialization of resolutions 4 approved, conditionally approved or denied at 5 last meeting, beginning with application 6 2007-073-SP, Roadway Express, located at 78 7 Second Street which is Block 295, Lots 8, 9,10 8 and 13 in the Town of Kearny, application 9 2008-003-SP which is Block 114 Development LLC 10 located at 1320-1330 Grand Street which is 11 Block 114 Lots 20 through 25 in the City of 12 Hoboken, and application 2008-024-SD, West 13 Hudson Builders, LLC located at 401 Ogden 14 Avenue which is Block 787, Lot 65 in the City 15 of Jersey City. 16 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Do we 17 have a motion to move? 18 COMMISSIONER CHOFFO: I will 19 make a motion. 20 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Do we 21 have a second? 22 COMMISSIONER BETTINGER: I will 23 second the motion. 24 DIRECTOR MARKS: Mr. Chairman, 25 on a motion to approve made by Commissioner 25 1 Choffo and seconded by Commissioner Bettinger, 2 Commissioner Arencibia? 3 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: Aye. 4 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 5 Bettinger? 6 COMMISSIONER BETTINGER: Aye. 7 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 8 Choffo? 9 COMMISSIONER CHOFFO: Aye. 10 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 11 DiDomenico? 12 COMMISSIONER DIDOMENICO: Aye. 13 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 14 Holloway? 15 COMMISSIONER HOLLOWAY: Aye. 16 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 17 Mehta? 18 COMMISSIONER MEHTA: Aye. 19 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 20 Munoz? 21 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: Aye. 22 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 23 Ng? 24 COMMISSIONER NG: Aye. 25 DIRECTOR MARKS: Chairman 26 1 Fitzgibbons? 2 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Aye. 3 DIRECTOR MARKS: Mr. Chairman, 4 the motion passed. 5 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Mr. 6 Secretary, do we have any applications to be 7 declared exempt? 8 DIRECTOR MARKS: Mr. Chairman, 9 the applications scheduled to be exempt 10 include one application which is 2008-034-SP, 11 New York SMSA Limited located at 630 Bergen 12 Avenue in the City of Jersey City. 13 COMMISSIONER BETTINGER: I will 14 make a motion. 15 COMMISSIONER MEHTA: I will 16 second. 17 DIRECTOR MARKS: Mr. Chairman, 18 on a motion made by Commissioner Bettinger and 19 seconded by Commissioner Mehta, Commissioner 20 Arencibia? 21 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: Aye. 22 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 23 Bettinger? 24 COMMISSIONER BETTINGER: Aye. 25 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 27 1 Choffo? 2 COMMISSIONER CHOFFO: Aye. 3 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 4 DiDomenico? 5 COMMISSIONER DIDOMENICO: Aye. 6 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 7 Holloway? 8 COMMISSIONER HOLLOWAY: Aye. 9 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 10 Mehta? 11 COMMISSIONER MEHTA: Aye. 12 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 13 Munoz? 14 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: Aye. 15 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 16 Ng? 17 COMMISSIONER NG: Aye. 18 DIRECTOR MARKS: Chairman 19 Fitzgibbons? 20 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Aye. 21 DIRECTOR MARKS: The motion 22 passed. 23 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Next is 24 site plan subdivision and other matters 25 scheduled for public hearing. 28 1 DIRECTOR MARKS: Mr. Chairman, 2 the first application scheduled for public 3 hearing this evening is application 4 2007-078-SP which is Block 114 Development LLC 5 located on Fourteenth Street which is Block 6 14, Lots 18, 19, and parts of 14 through 17 in 7 the City of Hoboken. 8 MR. CURLEY: John J. Curley, 9 C-U-R-L-E-Y appearing for the applicant, Block 10 114 Development LLC. 11 Mr. Chairman and members of the 12 Board, this is a continuation of a hearing 13 that was started last month. 14 It has to do with the proposed 15 movie theater along Fourteenth Street in 16 Hoboken. 17 At that time there were some 18 concerns expressed by the Board which we have 19 addressed and if I could tell you what those 20 concerns were and how we addressed them. 21 I would summarize it by saying 22 with respect to the canopy we would seek 23 permission at a later date to have that canopy 24 intrude -- I will speak up -- we will seek 25 permission from the county with respect to 29 1 encroachment of any canopy into the right of 2 way of Fourteenth Street which of course is a 3 county roadway. 4 So the canopy would not be part 5 of the design approved by the Board if the 6 Board approves the design this evening. 7 The second one was also with 8 respect to the canopy and that was the limited 9 to a three-foot width. 10 We will deal with that in the 11 context of an application for encroachment 12 into the county right of way. 13 On the design of the 14 intersection and the provision of handicapped 15 parking, the Hoboken Parking Utility has 16 agreed to establish a handicapped space on 17 Adams Street near the corner of Fourteenth and 18 a second handicapped space on Grand Street 19 near the corner of Fourteenth. 20 The curbs are going to be 21 replaced as part of the work and the 22 handicapped access ramps will be installed 23 from the curbs to the streets. 24 We have submitted to the Board a 25 statement from the Hoboken Fire Marshal. The 30 1 City took out the fire apparatus to make sure 2 that it would make the swing around Adams 3 Street on to Fourteenth Street, to make sure 4 that adequate fire protection would be 5 provided to the building. 6 And lastly I have the traffic 7 engineer with me this evening and also the 8 civil engineer. 9 The traffic engineer has at the 10 request of the planning director, submitted a 11 report with respect to ITE requirements on the 12 handicapped parking as they affect movie 13 theaters and with that, Mr. Chairman, if the 14 Board wishes to see a presentation of the 15 turning radius map or any of the other 16 materials, I will ask one of the experts to 17 come and present. 18 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: We did 19 receive the letter from the -- right? We got 20 the letter from the fire marshal? 21 DIRECTOR MARKS: I am in receipt 22 of three letters. A cover letter from Mr. 23 Fred Bado who is director of community 24 development for the City of Hoboken, a signed 25 letter by Robert Falco who is the captain fire 31 1 marshal for the City of Hoboken, and a signed 2 letter by John Corea, C-O-R-E-A, regarding the 3 addition of ADA accessible parking spaces, one 4 on Grand and one on Adams Street. 5 So I will share them with the 6 Board. 7 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: I think 8 we have the copies. It is in our packet. 9 DIRECTOR MARKS: No, it is not. 10 We could have Daniela hand them out. 11 Mr. Chairman, they are in your 12 packets, I am sorry. 13 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Do you 14 have anything to say? 15 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: I think 16 the letter from the fire marshal is based on 17 the current condition of the Fourteenth Street 18 viaduct and we reviewed in the last meeting 19 minutes that was discussed that the Fourteenth 20 Street viaduct is going to be under 21 construction which is the reason why we don't 22 want the canopy until we, until the viaduct is 23 completed and you are going to come back to 24 the county for permission for the canopy. 25 MR. CURLEY: That is correct. 32 1 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: So at 2 that time as well I think the fire code or the 3 fire marshal needs to also evaluate again the 4 safety of the canopy. 5 MR. CURLEY: In order to do that 6 in advance we have had to civil engineer do a 7 turning radius study using the county's plans 8 for the new viaduct and we have submitted that 9 study to the Board. 10 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: Okay. 11 Does that account for the canopy 12 in place as well? 13 MR. CURLEY: No, it doesn't 14 address the canopy, it addresses solely 15 turning radius for the fire truck from Adams 16 Street onto Fourteenth. But it assumes the 17 replacement of the viaduct with the new 18 design. 19 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: That is 20 fine. But in the future when you come back 21 for the canopy, I think we would also like the 22 fire marshal to look at that again because his 23 letter is based on the current condition of 24 the Fourteenth Street viaduct. 25 MR. CURLEY: That is correct. 33 1 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: Other 2 things that I want to make sure don't 3 interfere with the construction of the 4 viaduct, is the trees. 5 And I know you are proposing 6 trees and I am recommending that they be 7 placed in planters that so that they could be 8 moved, maybe concrete planters because at some 9 point those trees, if you place them in there, 10 they are going to be moved during any 11 construction. 12 MR. CURLEY: We will do whatever 13 the county requires on the county roadside. 14 Hoboken is requiring other 15 things on Adams and Grand, but certainly other 16 than the county side, whatever the county 17 directs us to do. 18 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: I am 19 recommending you put them in. And planters 20 that they could be moved with a backhoe if 21 need be. 22 And you mentioned before, I had 23 to step out for a minute, but you were going 24 to prepare plans showing the crosswalks be 25 painted and signs as well? 34 1 MR. CURLEY: That plan has been 2 submitted as well. 3 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: It was 4 submitted? 5 MR. CURLEY: It is on the site 6 plan. 7 MR. MISSEY: My name is Andrew 8 Missey. I was here before you at the last 9 hearing. 10 I am from Lapatka Associates and 11 in response to the questions from -- 12 MR. CURLEY: You should be 13 sworn. 14 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Were you 15 sworn in before us? 16 MR. MISSEY: Yes. 17 ATTORNEY CALVANICO: He should 18 be sworn for this hearing. 19 State your name, spell your last 20 name. 21 MR. MISSEY: Andrew H. Missey, 22 M-I-S-S-E-Y. 23 (Andrew Missey was duly sworn.) 24 MR. MISSEY: Again, continuing 25 from last month, we have in response to the 35 1 questions regarding the crosswalk painting, 2 prepared a drawing entitled Exhibit -- 3 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Can you 4 mark that? 5 MR. MISSEY: I will mark it A-2. 6 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Yes. 7 MR. MISSEY: With this month's 8 date. 9 (Exhibit so marked.) 10 MR. MISSEY: Referring 11 to the exhibit marked A-2, intersects pavement 12 striping and fire apparatus turning movements, 13 Block 114 turning 409-415 Fourteenth Street 14 prepared by Lapatka Associates, one sheet with 15 the date of March 31st of this year. 16 The topmost portion of the plan 17 illustrates on the left side of this drawing 18 the ADA accessible parking space that will be 19 painted on the Adams Street and Fourteenth on 20 the Adams Street right of way within the 21 roadway as well as two crosswalks, one 22 crosswalk in the painted crosswalk stretching 23 in the westerly direction which will go from 24 the cinema site over to the retail site which 25 is presently under construction and a second 36 1 crosswalk extending from the corner of the 2 cinema to the north to the opposite side or on 3 the other side underneath the viaduct. 4 This drawing makes mention that 5 this crosswalk striping will be coordinated 6 with the terminus of the county's viaduct 7 plans once those plans are issued. 8 In the same manner, on the same 9 side of the upper right of the sheet we have 10 identified the Grand Street at Fourteenth 11 Street intersection which has a very similar 12 street. 13 ADA parking space alongside the 14 curb immediately adjoining the cinema site, 15 the crosswalk to the east to connect to the 16 sidewalks on the opposite side where Metro 17 Homes has its office building and the 18 crosswalk to the north again under the viaduct 19 with the same note that the terminus of that 20 crosswalk striping will be coordinated with 21 the county's plans. 22 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: Mr. 23 Chairman? 24 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Yes. 25 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: How many 37 1 parking spaces did you say they are going to 2 have in there, 80? 3 MR. MISSEY: There will be two 4 ADA accessible. Americans with Disability 5 Act. 6 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: How many 7 parking spaces total? 8 MR. MISSEY: Two. 9 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: That's it? 10 Trying to fit 985 people in the building and 11 only two accessible parking spaces? 12 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: 13 Handicapped. Once again I think -- 14 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: There is no 15 plan to build a parking space? 16 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: No. 17 Commissioner, this is what happened in the 18 last meeting. You weren't here. 19 There was a big thing to do with 20 it. As you seen before this plan that we were 21 just going to adopt, Hoboken has a walking 22 community. 23 Hoboken does not want to have, 24 be between the Lincoln and Holland Tunnel. 25 The carbon monoxide there, the air quality. 38 1 Hoboken is a walking community. 2 Already are there parking 3 facilities, paved parking facilities? I 4 believe near the place, but -- right? There 5 is public parking? 6 MR. CURLEY: Within a block and 7 a half. 8 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: A block 9 and a half. That was the sticking point of 10 the whole thing that we made, there was a few 11 things we discussed. 12 It is a walking community and 13 actually that is part of the redevelopment 14 plan that the City of Hoboken, part of their 15 redevelopment plan in the master plan and most 16 of it, Hoboken hasn't had enough parking 17 facilities as it is, so they would rather have 18 people from the communities walk to there. 19 I think that's the whole idea. 20 I believe that was the whole idea on that 21 concept. 22 MR. CURLEY: Yes. The 23 redevelopment plan in -- the northwest 24 redevelopment plan was amended by the City 25 Council to permit a movie theater of this type 39 1 without providing off street parking. 2 COMMISSIONER BETTINGER: Mr. 3 Chairman, is there any way that you could 4 revise the plan putting some parking 5 underneath? 6 MR. CURLEY: Hoboken doesn't 7 want any parking at that location. 8 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: Mr. 9 Chairman? 10 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Yes. 11 COMMISSIONER BETTINGER: They 12 said they wanted no parking. 13 MR. CURLEY: That's correct. 14 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: Mr. 15 Chairman, has there been any study done on the 16 condition the congestion is going to create on 17 the county road? 18 MR. CURLEY: I have the parking 19 engineer who can explain what parking 20 facilities are available nearby and how they 21 would accommodate any parking that would be 22 required. 23 Bearing in mind that this is 24 intended to be more of a neighborhood facility 25 than some type of regional theater. 40 1 This is not like the theater in 2 Edgewater that has a large surface parking 3 lot. This is a theater with multiple screens 4 with approximately 900to 950 person full 5 capacity and it is located in a very densely 6 populated neighborhood. 7 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: Mr. 8 Chairman, I think if the facility is trying to 9 bring 985 people into a building, they are 10 going to create a lot of congestion. 11 Say they put a movie in a hit 12 and a lot of people are going to want to see 13 that movie. 14 They are going to create a 15 tremendous condition on the county road and 16 not only that, around the area there are 17 residents buildings, right? Residential 18 buildings. 19 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Actually 20 the area is being redeveloped. It is going to 21 have many, many multiple dwelling units in 22 that area. 23 It is going to be -- actually 24 there should be at least maybe I figure, I am 25 just taking the figure off the top of my head, 41 1 I figure another, close to another five, six 2 hundred dwelling units in the area. 3 I will tell you, it is going to 4 be developed, that whole area going to be 5 developed. Parks down there and everything. 6 That is part of a plan to put a 7 theater there, some parks. I think the county 8 is going to do a little bit under the viaduct, 9 a little bit of walking area. 10 COMMISSIONER CHOFFO: I have one 11 question for Mr. Curley. 12 This has been approved by 13 Hoboken? Just refresh my memory. 14 MR. CURLEY: Yes. Approved by 15 the Hoboken Planning Board and approved by the 16 Hoboken City Council as part of an amendment 17 to the redevelopment plan. 18 I would point out it is also 19 consistent with the county's projected 20 possible closure of sections of Fourteenth 21 Street coming west from Willow in which there 22 is an intention by the county expressed to 23 create a walking environment rather than have 24 motor vehicles in that location. 25 I believe the county engineer is 42 1 aware of that. 2 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: Yes. 3 That part of the Fourteenth 4 Street viaduct project that we are working on 5 is looking to improve the street level on the 6 viaduct and to make it into a pedestrian 7 friendly mall area. 8 So it could mean closing off 9 Marginal Road at least but still allow through 10 street traffic from the side streets. 11 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: But not 12 going through? 13 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: Not 14 along Marginal Road, but that is something we 15 are going to be discussing with the City in a 16 couple of weeks. 17 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: I would 18 like to ask the engineer how are they going to 19 prevent -- they are talking about making a 20 walking, a walking area, but how are they 21 going to prevent cars coming in, people from 22 all the towns coming into the theater? 23 I mean that's not creating 24 congestion in the area with parking space, 25 that's creating congestion in the area with 43 1 traffic. 2 Is that county road prepared for 3 the traffic that this type of facility is 4 going to bring into this area? 5 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: I think 6 from the last meeting there was -- I wasn't 7 present at the last meeting, but I reviewed 8 the minutes from the last meeting. 9 The traffic engineer gave some 10 testimony that the patrons of the theater 11 would be using a nearby parking garage if they 12 are going which was about two or three blocks 13 away on Fourteenth Street, and other parking 14 facilities nearby. 15 But I think they are stressing 16 that Hoboken is a pedestrian city, that most 17 of the people are going to be people walking. 18 It is really serving the people of Hoboken, 19 and that the other communities already have 20 theaters. 21 So in reading the testimony from 22 the last meeting about the traffic, definitely 23 there will be cars dropping off people or that 24 are from the other end of town, but the 25 traffic engineer already provided his 44 1 testimony. 2 There isn't a breakdown of 3 traffic that is going to occur. 4 COMMISSIONER CHOFFO: Mr. 5 Chairman? 6 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: 7 Commissioner Choffo. 8 COMMISSIONER CHOFFO: The whole 9 thing is there are theaters that have the huge 10 parking facilities in Edgewater and around us 11 maybe only 10, 15 minutes away probably 12 showing the same movies. 13 They don't want -- actually 14 Hoboken is a one square mile very congested 15 and, you know, in that area is going to be 16 developed but also it takes waterfront that 17 was redeveloped years ago. Thousands of units 18 up there. 19 Maxwell House and Lipton Tea and 20 all that area is within walking distance. 21 That is what I see as -- I see what is going 22 on there. 23 The way they redevelop, they 24 want people to walk. And Hoboken is a walking 25 community. Because you can't park. You can't 45 1 park anywhere. I don't care if you have 100 2 parking spots in there, you are still not 3 going to have enough parking in Hoboken. 4 There is zoned parking. You got 5 to be a resident to park in Hoboken. If you 6 are not a paying resident and don't have a 7 resident permit, they will boot you. 8 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: 9 Ultimately if the theater becomes difficult to 10 park you are not going to get customers. 11 If you can't get parking you are 12 not going to want to go there. 13 But I think most of the people 14 will be coming from the City itself, the City 15 of Hoboken, that will be using the theater. 16 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: It is a 17 five screen theater? Five, right? 18 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Yeah. 19 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: But 985 20 people, if it was a smaller facility that 21 would be fine, but you are trying to create a 22 facility that would fit a lot of people. 23 People are going to come with 24 cars and create a traffic problem on the 25 county road. 46 1 Chairman, I ask the county road 2 now has a traffic congestion problem or no? 3 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: In the 4 immediate area of this theater, no. There is 5 very little traffic. The streets are really 6 very little traffic. 7 But if you go to Willow Avenue 8 and Fourteenth Street, there is congestion 9 there during the peak hours. 10 The theater would be operating 11 mostly in the evening or weekends when the 12 traffic is lighter on our county roads. 13 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: Have they 14 considered to make a smaller theater in this 15 area maybe to fit less amount of people? 16 MR. CURLEY: The location of 17 this county road is really just Marginal Road 18 below the viaduct. It is only a county road 19 because you have the viaduct carrying all the 20 traffic up above. The surface on Fourteenth 21 Street is hardly ever used. 22 As a matter of fact, I would 23 think that as a result of this project and 24 other projects, that surface will be smoothed 25 out. 47 1 At this point I wouldn't want to 2 drive any car down that road in its current 3 condition. 4 It bears only minimal traffic 5 today. 6 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: It is 7 actually, the property down there is all 8 industrial. There is no -- that is what the 9 development area is, all the industrial. The 10 whole site, they are going to develop down 11 there and Fourteenth Street, like he said, you 12 can't drive down that. It is all -- he can 13 tell you. 14 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: Well, 15 in the area in front of the theater it is 16 actually one of the better spots, Marginal 17 Road. 18 If you go further west of there 19 it is really almost impossible. It is 20 something that the county will address in its 21 Fourteenth Street viaduct project. 22 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Also it 23 is not far from the Light Rail. There is a 24 Light Rail stop right on 9th Street and an 25 elevator that comes from Congress Street, 48 1 comes down to 9th so people actually in Union 2 City and Jersey City in the Heights can take 3 the elevator down, walk to the theater and go 4 see the movie. 5 Am I right? 6 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: It is 7 very close, the 9th Street Station. 8 COMMISSIONER MEHTA: Mr. 9 Chairman? 10 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Yes. 11 COMMISSIONER MEHTA: Fourteenth 12 Street, is it a one-way or two-way traffic and 13 how big is the 4th Street? 14 MR. CURLEY: One way on one side 15 of the viaduct and one way on the opposite 16 side of the viaduct, I believe. 17 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Actually, 18 if you think of 4th Street as you think of 19 Fourteenth Street, the extension that we are 20 looking at is all cobblestone, part pavement, 21 part dirt. It is hardly ever used. 22 The only time I use it is when 23 there is a lot of traffic and it is like a 24 roller coaster going over the bumps trying to 25 get through the city. 49 1 But it is an all industrial 2 area. That is why it is being redeveloped. 3 Am I right? 4 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: Yeah. 5 If we can go back to the last 6 meeting, in reviewing the minutes I think Mr. 7 Jasek at the time and I think the whole Board 8 summarized the characteristics of this 9 neighborhood and there were five issues that 10 need to be addressed. I am going to recite 11 them. 12 Issue No. 1 would be no canopy 13 be constructed until the construction of the 14 viaduct is completed. 15 Number 2 was the maximum 16 intrusion of the new canopy after the 17 construction should be no more than three feet 18 into the Hudson County right of way. 19 And number three would be the 20 condition of providing a detailed design of 21 the intersection of Marginal Road and Grand 22 Avenue and Adams Avenue to indicate the 23 crosswalks, stop signs, proper intersection 24 for the pedestrians. 25 Number four would be the fire 50 1 marshal approval. 2 And number five would be to 3 recommend the municipality provide several 4 handicapped spots on the side streets on Adams 5 and Grand. 6 So I think you have already 7 indicated that you are not going to construct 8 a canopy, you will come back for that when you 9 are ready. 10 MR. CURLEY: Yes, we would need 11 a franchise from the county to built that. 12 COMMISSIONER MEHTA: I was just 13 trying to understand the traffic pattern, 14 whether this is one way traffic or whether it 15 says -- I see on the picture there is, on the 16 side there is a couple of cars parked. 17 If you did that already, street 18 parking is available on the street and when 19 they are saying there will be drop off area, 20 how big is the drop off area and how many cars 21 will be staying in that area to drop off the 22 people? 23 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Can I see 24 that picture? 25 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: I 51 1 believe at the last meeting, I wasn't present, 2 but in reading the minutes that was discussed 3 that the drop-off area would -- was 4 recommended and I think it was agreed not to 5 provide a pull-out for that. 6 MR. CURLEY: I think it was 7 indicated it would be better not to have a 8 drop-off area off street. 9 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: Off 10 Marginal Road because there was really no room 11 for it. 12 MR. CURLEY: Really no room. 13 MR. MUNOZ: The county road is 14 three on the picture, the one that is in bad 15 condition now? 16 MR. TRIDENTE: That is it. 17 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: So the 18 county would have to spend money on fixing the 19 road? 20 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: We will 21 be upgrading the street level underneath the 22 viaduct as part of the project. 23 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: I think 24 it needs a little bit of upgrading. 25 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: We are 52 1 looking to do a significant upgrade. 2 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Actually 3 I think the municipality or the county really 4 didn't want anybody to use that road. 5 Am I right? 6 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: Part of 7 the improvements will involve streetscape. 8 COMMISSIONER CHOFFO: At the 9 last meeting, I want to state for the record, 10 I believe Mr. Curley and his client came 11 through with all the five issues that we 12 discussed at the last meeting. 13 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Yes. 14 COMMISSIONER CHOFFO: So without 15 rehashing the same details since we have an 16 agenda, unless any other Commissioners have 17 questions. 18 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: Mr. 19 Chairman, I just wanted, because this is the 20 first time I am seeing this traffic plan, I do 21 have some comments on it but they are minor so 22 just a conditional approval of this site plan 23 but I need to take a closer look at it and 24 provide you with the comments. 25 MR. CURLEY: Very good. 53 1 ATTORNEY CALVANICO: Since the 2 diagram is here and it was initialed here 3 about the traffic and turning radius, if Mr. 4 Missey would go through the two other diagrams 5 that he posted there just to indicate what the 6 turning radiuses were. 7 MR. CURLEY: Mr. Missey, if you 8 could. 9 MR. MISSEY: I will now speak to 10 the turning movement diagrams that are on A-2. 11 To the lower left of the sheet 12 is a diagram indicating how the Hoboken, the 13 Hoboken ladder truck would access Fourteenth 14 Street in a northbound manner coming along 15 Adams Street. 16 What we have done is onto the 17 drawing that is before you we have shown the 18 ladder truck's movement onto this site and we 19 have done that by communicating with Captain 20 Falco of the Hoboken Fire Department and 21 selecting the turning, the turning template 22 that most appropriately approximates that 23 vehicle's size. 24 The vehicle size that Hoboken 25 has is approximately 47 feet in length. It is 54 1 a nine and a half foot wide fire truck. It -- 2 actually it is a little narrower than that and 3 the wheel base is 258 inches, probably a 4 little less actually because Hoboken has 5 equipment for an urban environment. 6 In any case, this diagram at the 7 lower left of the drawing clearly shows that 8 with the curb lines in their present 9 configuration, the truck can make the movement 10 northward on Adams Street and clearly make the 11 turn onto the eastbound Marginal Road in the 12 present configuration. 13 Similarly on the right side of 14 the drawing we have the fire apparatus turning 15 movements from Grand Street in a southbound 16 direction because that is the direction of 17 Grand Street in Hoboken onto Fourteenth Street 18 to the west. 19 Also we have included on this 20 the movement from the westbound viaduct street 21 or the Marginal Road onto Grand Street in the 22 southerly direction. 23 So this diagram or this part of 24 the exhibit illustrates that the, the turning, 25 there is ample room within the curb lines as 55 1 they sit right now to accommodate Hoboken's 2 apparatus which is what Captain Falco 3 performed in the field and certified to in his 4 letter to the Board. 5 ATTORNEY CALVANICO: Mr. 6 Chairman, if I might? 7 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Yes. 8 ATTORNEY CALVANICO: This 9 doesn't reflect the new configuration of the 10 Fourteenth Street viaduct, correct? 11 MR. MISSEY: At this point we 12 just don't know what the new configuration 13 will be. 14 ATTORNEY CALVANICO: I wanted to 15 make that clear. Maybe I misheard it earlier, 16 but I thought Mr. Curley indicated that the 17 plan was done in accordance with the county's 18 proposed plan with the viaduct. It is not. 19 What they are saying, the fire 20 chief is saying the truck can make the turn 21 now. 22 MR. CURLEY: What I meant 23 before, and you can ask Mr. Missey, it took 24 into consideration the upper level of the 25 viaduct because we don't have a drawing of 56 1 that. 2 We don't have a drawing of what 3 the county will do on the street level. 4 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Widen the 5 viaduct underneath or be almost the same. 6 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: The 7 viaduct is going to get widened on the bridge 8 itself. Underneath the piers will be roughly 9 the same width as they are right now. 10 Right now they are very wide but 11 it might be narrower than what it is. We are 12 going to maintain the marginal roads. 13 As far as the width of the 14 marginal roads, what they are going to be, 15 that hasn't been designed yet but I would 16 still think that fire trucks could still get 17 through. 18 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: Thank you. 19 One question. 20 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Go ahead. 21 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: On the 22 pictures there is a light here or a stop sign. 23 Stop sign. 24 What is the main streets? 25 MR. CURLEY: There are no lights 57 1 in that neighborhood at this point. 2 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: What is the 3 main street here? 4 MR. CURLEY: There is no main 5 street in that neighborhood. Willow Avenue is 6 the closest main street. 7 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: My opinion, 8 I would not vote for this unless there is a 9 traffic study. 10 There is no traffic lights 11 around here which means they are going to have 12 to install traffic lights. 13 How much traffic is this going 14 to create? 15 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: You don't 16 understand where it is. It is going to be a 17 residential area down there. A residential 18 and recreational area. 19 I don't think right now you -- I 20 don't think there will be traffic lights. 21 COMMISSIONER NG: Mr. Chairman, 22 when people ready to get into the theater it 23 will be a lot of traffic. It will be. 24 I mean in Union City we have a 25 couple of theaters without parking in the 58 1 past. We had one on Bergenline and it was 2 chaos. 3 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: When that 4 happens if the municipality -- first of all it 5 is not a county road. 6 COMMISSIONER NG: But if we can 7 prevent that. What you are doing before it 8 happens. 9 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: That 10 would have to be, if it is on a county road 11 the light, I don't know how you could put a 12 light where the viaduct is. 13 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: Mr. 14 Chairman, does the applicant have his traffic 15 engineer present? 16 MR. CURLEY: Yes, I do. 17 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: Maybe 18 he should provide some testimony. 19 ATTORNEY CALVANICO: State your 20 name spell your last name. 21 MR. PAVLOVICH: John Pavlovich, 22 P-A-V-L-O-I-C-H. 23 (John Pavlovich was duly sworn.) 24 MR. CURLEY: Mr. Pavlovich, can 25 you review some of your testimony from the 59 1 last hearing concerning how the traffic would 2 work in relation to this proposed theater and 3 how off-street parking is to be accommodated 4 for the theater. 5 MR. PAVLOVICH: As a precursor 6 to that, the area does not -- the cinema does 7 not require off-street parking. 8 The typical of most urban areas 9 there is a central parking source to satisfy 10 retail needs. 11 That is consistent with what the 12 City of Hoboken has proposed in their 13 redevelopment plan for accommodating parking 14 for people that visit the cinema or daycare, 15 or attend any of their patron activities at 16 any of the retail establishments. 17 With that being said, there is 18 no parking for the cinema. However, there is 19 parking, as counsel has said, and also 20 previously stated in the record, there are two 21 large parking facilities two to three blocks 22 east of the site of the cinema and that is 23 where the people would be parking. 24 In most areas if you go into 25 Hoboken in particular you are not going to 60 1 find people looking to get a parking spot 2 either because of resident permits or other 3 requirements, but they are not going to find a 4 parking space. They are going to go where 5 they can get the parking, the off-street 6 parking located on Fourteenth Street and 4th 7 Street. 8 In terms of the existing traffic 9 on the streets right now, Adams Street has 10 maybe 80 to 90 vehicles heading northbound in 11 the morning and southbound on Grand you get, 12 you will get numbers similar to maybe 150 to 13 175. 14 With all the new development, 15 you are having traffic adding maybe 50 to 75 16 vehicles in each direction during the peak 17 hours. 18 So each of those streets would 19 have roughly 200 do 250 vehicles northbound, 20 or p.m., or during the a.m. or p.m. peak 21 hours. 22 DIRECTOR MARKS: For the record, 23 can Mr. Pavlovich identify how many parking 24 spaces are available in each of the two 25 structures he just mentioned. 61 1 MR. PAVLOVICH: I don't have 2 those numbers with me. 3 MR. CURLEY: One is the parking 4 garage which is on Park Avenue, I believe. 5 MR. PAVLOVICH: Correct. 6 MR. CURLEY: How many stories, 7 approximately. 8 MR. PAVLOVICH: Seven. 9 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: Seven 10 stories? 11 MR. CURLEY: And the other is 12 the BDLJ parking lot. What is that, eight 13 stories? 14 MR. PAVLOVICH: Somewhere 15 between six and eight, I haven't gone all the 16 way up to the top. 17 COMMISSIONER MEHTA: Mr. 18 Chairman, you mentioned that most of the 19 patrons that will come to the surrounding 20 neighborhood is going to park in the parking 21 lot and they are going to come and visit and 22 park. 23 In that, just two quick 24 questions. You are mentioning about the 25 drop-off area. 62 1 How big is the drop-off areas 2 and how many cars at a time can drop off the 3 patrons. 4 MR. PAVLOVICH: Before I answer 5 that, this is supposed to be marketed as a 6 neighborhood theater. 7 Hoboken prides itself in being a 8 walkable -- it is an urban village with a 9 walkable environment. 10 The idea is not to have people 11 coming to the theater with an automobile. It 12 doesn't preclude coming by automobile, but I 13 would liken it to people trying to go to a 14 theater in Manhattan where there is no 15 parking. 16 If there isn't parking 17 available, people are going to come by transit 18 or walk or park in the garages that are 19 located over on Park Avenue. 20 That is my understanding. 21 COMMISSIONER MEHTA: I 22 understand your argument. At the same time 23 Commissioner Ng said in Union City the parking 24 where the theater is on Smith Avenue and when 25 popular movie is showing at that time most of 63 1 the people have double parked on the street 2 and they drop off the people and create a 3 little bit traffic problem, congestion, so 4 that's why I am asking when you are trying to 5 create the drop-off area, how big is the 6 drop-off area and how many cars at a time can 7 drop off the people. 8 My question is only that. 9 MR. CURLEY: Mr. Commissioner, 10 at the last meeting we had this discussion 11 about drop-off areas and we don't want a 12 drop-off area because to have a drop-off area 13 would be an invitation for automotive use. 14 We don't want cars coming to the 15 theater if we can avoid it. 16 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: I got to 17 ask Mr. Arencibia. 18 Can you -- actually on those 19 streets you cannot stand in those streets that 20 are there now. 21 If you park a car you ain't 22 getting past. If somebody would put a vehicle 23 in that street and just let it stay there for 24 20, 30 minutes or an hour you are not moving. 25 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: The 64 1 streets are narrow. 2 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: The 3 streets are narrow. It is not made for 4 drop-off. 5 Right now I cannot -- if there 6 was an industry, industrial site there right 7 on that, you cannot park on that. The only 8 way you could park is on the sidewalk. 9 It is very narrow. You could 10 understand the situation. Here is the 11 viaduct. One side is like this and the other 12 side is like that (indicating). 13 That is because Hoboken wanted 14 it there to there and because of the 15 redevelopment plan. You can't stand there 16 now. 17 No standing signs are going to 18 be there anyway. I believe that's what is 19 going to happen. 20 I believe when it is 21 redevelopment in that area there and when the 22 county redevelops their plan for the viaduct 23 there is going to be no standing. 24 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: There 25 is no parking or stopping or standing allowed 65 1 right now along the Fourteenth Street marginal 2 streets. 3 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: Mr. 4 Chairman. 5 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: 6 Commissioner Munoz. 7 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: This is New 8 Jersey Transit over here, right? 9 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: No. That 10 is not New Jersey Transit. That is -- what is 11 that -- is that New Jersey Transit? That is a 12 private company, isn't it? 13 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: Which 14 photo? 15 MR. CURLEY: The bus. 16 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: The bus 17 lot. 18 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: 19 Commissioner DiDomenico? 20 MR. CURLEY: Academy. 21 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: When the 22 buses go out what way they go? 23 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: They go 24 out towards 16th Street. 25 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: They 66 1 don't drop on Fourteenth Street. 2 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: So they go 3 this way (indicating). 4 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: They go 5 out towards -- what they do is go out towards 6 16th Street and go over to the Lincoln tunnel. 7 That is all New York buses. Commuter buses 8 for New York. 9 Am I right? 10 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: They 11 have another entrance, I think it is on 15th. 12 But I know they have a driveway off of 13 Fourteenth Street. 14 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: That is 15 not used. 16 COMMISSIONER BETTINGER: With 17 that being said, you are stating the streets 18 are so narrow, I have a problem with safety or 19 the patrons of the theater and for the fire 20 department to get down there after the 21 construction of the viaduct. There are 985 22 seats in this theater. 23 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: I don't 24 think, personally I don't think you are going 25 to fill 980 people there. 67 1 COMMISSIONER BETTINGER: Then 2 you should make a smaller theater. 3 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: We cannot 4 ask them to build a smaller theater. You 5 can't tell the people developing the area. 6 You cannot dictate to them what 7 they want to develop. The turnpike approved 8 this and that is why we are here, just to see 9 that first of all the county roads are not 10 infringed upon. 11 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: Mr. 12 Chairman? 13 COMMISSIONER BETTINGER: But we 14 are not going to rubber stamp something we 15 feel is wrong or else why appear before us. 16 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: Is the 17 county viaduct -- we have to think what this 18 construction is going to have on the county 19 road. 20 This is going to create traffic. 21 There is no question about it. It is going to 22 create safety issue and impacting county road. 23 We are not talking about city, 24 it is impacting county road. Unless they 25 provide a smaller facility or provide space it 68 1 is going to impact county road. 2 If they don't want -- it is bad 3 planning to put this type of facility on this 4 place. You are trying to squeeze 985 theater 5 into an area that -- look the amount of 6 residential it is created in there. 7 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Can I say 8 something? There is a lot of negatives here, 9 but if you read the plan we just approved, we 10 introduced, rather. 11 This is what the future is. 12 They don't want people to use their vehicles. 13 They want people to walk to where they want 14 entertainment where they want to dine that is 15 the future it is going to grow. 16 My personal opinion, you live in 17 a community, it is going to affect you sooner 18 or later. It is going to expand. It is going 19 to change, your community is going to change, 20 Union City is going to change, Jersey City is 21 changing. 22 The future in another 25 years, 23 you are a young guy, you will see it. I seen 24 it because I worked 38 years as an inspector 25 for the City of Hoboken and if you knew 69 1 Hoboken 38 years ago it was all different 2 situation. 3 It is expanding because of the, 4 because of its location next to New York. 5 That is why they built mass transit. That's 6 why they built the Light Rail, okay? 7 Hoboken is actually considered 8 to me almost like a borough of New York City 9 that you cannot park there, you have to walk, 10 and that is what is happening there and parts 11 of Jersey City is the same way. 12 That is the future. That is 13 what the future is going to be in Union City 14 because they are going to be developing there. 15 It is happening in West New York 16 on the waterfront in Weehawken. That is what 17 the future is. 18 COMMISSIONER NG: Hoboken 19 already has all these problems with transit, 20 whatever. Why create more problems? Is it 21 986? 22 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Do you 23 actually think -- what theater do you know is 24 going to have 900 people come to the theater 25 unless it is Gone with the Wind back in 1938? 70 1 Come on. Face reality. It is, 2 to me it is a dark horse. You are not going 3 to get 980 people. 4 That's what Hoboken wants. 5 Maybe you would be lucky if you get 100 people 6 to go to that theater. 7 They had a theater there 8 already. 9 MR. CURLEY: They won't be in 10 the same auditorium because there are five 11 auditoriums. 12 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: That is 13 what I am trying to explain. This is what the 14 future is. This is what the future of the 15 county is. 16 This is why there is a master 17 plan. Plans like this. Read the plan. He 18 just got up and said they want everybody to 19 use bicycles and walk because of what? 20 Because of the green house effect? Who wants 21 this? 22 It is my community, your 23 community. You don't want the traffic. 24 We have traffic in Hoboken from 25 everywhere because we are located between the 71 1 Lincoln and Holland Tunnel. They come in, in 2 and out, in and out, in and out. 3 We breathe the air. I breathe 4 the air. The citizens breathe the air. The 5 Heights breathe the air because it affects up 6 there in Union City too because they are close 7 to the Lincoln Tunnel. 8 They don't want people to drive 9 in Hoboken, they want people to walk, they 10 want people to use their bicycles. They want 11 to go green. That is what it is. That is the 12 future. 13 If you don't like it, vote it 14 down, that's all. That's all. That's all I 15 got to say. But it is going to come back to 16 you. It is going to come back to you. 17 You are a young guy, you will 18 see it. You are a young guy too, you will see 19 it. 20 COMMISSIONER NG: Not that 21 young. 22 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: You will 23 see it too. You will see it. In Harrison it 24 is already happening there where you live, 25 right? The redevelopment. 72 1 Down there, do they want you to 2 drive a car down there? 3 COMMISSIONER CHOFFO: No. 4 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: All 5 right. That is what the whole idea is. It is 6 new. 7 COMMISSIONER BETTINGER: Mr. 8 Chairman, the thing I am concerned about is 9 safety with a fire truck. 10 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: They 11 already gave you a plan. 12 COMMISSIONER BETTINGER: That is 13 before the construction of the viaduct. 14 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: No. 15 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: I think 16 we already discussed that with the new 17 viaduct. The footprint appears it is going to 18 likely stay the same. 19 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: It is 20 going to be the same. 21 COMMISSIONER BETTINGER: Is the 22 street going to be wide enough after the 23 creation of the viaduct? 24 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: We 25 haven't designed them yet, but the marginal 73 1 road can be as wide as they are now. 2 COMMISSIONER BETTINGER: And Mr. 3 Chairman, you have just stated that the roads 4 are extremely narrow in that area. 5 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: They just 6 gave you a study. The fire marshal who is 7 certified by the Sate of New Jersey who has a 8 license just told you, who has the city 9 authority to say his rigs are going to make 10 those turns. 11 We can't tell the fire marshal 12 whether he is right or wrong. I have that 13 certification. I have that certification. I 14 am a fire official, all right? But you guys 15 don't. You can't tell. 16 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: I think 17 the narrow streets, we mentioned that because 18 it doesn't give anybody the opportunity to 19 double park just like if you drive through 20 many streets of Hoboken parking on both sides 21 as there are on Adams and Grand here and 22 nobody is going to be able to stop. 23 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: You can't 24 stop there. 25 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: And let 74 1 people wait to pick up somebody because it is 2 just not possible. 3 COMMISSIONER MEHTA: Chairman, I 4 understand during the -- sorry, I was absent 5 last meeting so I try to read the transcript 6 and tried to understand the previous 7 application. 8 When you say the future, you are 9 arguing there is no drop-off, they are 10 encouraging the patrons to walk or use a 11 bicycle. 12 Do they plan to have a bicycle 13 rack? 14 MR. CURLEY: We would be happy 15 to -- 16 MR. PAVLOVICH: I would defer -- 17 the civil engineer gave testimony they would 18 provide bike racks if it was so requested, but 19 I don't understand why they wouldn't be. 20 COMMISSIONER BETTINGER: I 21 believe at the last meeting I asked that 22 question and Mr. Jasek said they were going to 23 do something with bicycle racks underneath the 24 viaduct. 25 MR. CURLEY: That is correct. I 75 1 recollect that as well. 2 The space under the viaduct will 3 not be used for any parking, it is going to be 4 used primarily as open space and as passive 5 open space with bike racks. 6 COMMISSIONER MEHTA: I 7 understand for Hoboken the government approved 8 the application and at the same time if it is 9 not -- according to the traffic expert, if it 10 is not going to congest county road, but at 11 the same time I will prefer and I will 12 recommend that bicycle rack and bicycle 13 parking supposed to provide for the patrons. 14 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: Not 15 bicycle, I think -- this is a huge facility, 16 985 people. I mean they should consider 17 something smaller, that would be 18 understandable, but 985 people in this type of 19 facility, you have so many safety issues. 20 This is bad planning to put 21 something like that. 22 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Let me 23 explain something to you also. When you say 24 safety issues, fire safety, that building will 25 be fully suppressed. That building will be up 76 1 to the latest state fire codes or even better 2 as far as egresses and fire safety, so you 3 just don't approve a building, especially a 4 place of assembly. 5 You don't approve that unless 6 you meet the recommendations of the New Jersey 7 state fire safety code which is stringent. It 8 is one of the most stringent codes in the 9 country. So that is moot to me. 10 If you know anything about 11 building codes you know that you just don't 12 build a place of assembly, especially -- and I 13 am going to say there will never be 950 14 occupants of that building and I personally, 15 my ability, my feeling, it might wind up being 16 an office building down in the future because 17 to me I don't know how this is going to exist 18 because I only can see maybe at the most maybe 19 two to 300 people at one time using that 20 building. 21 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: Something 22 happens in there, how are they going to get 23 access to ambulance, access to all that? 24 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: When you 25 create a facility like that, there is a plan, 77 1 there is a fire department plan, there is a 2 public safety plan evacuating the building and 3 that is all about the fire code and safety 4 code in the State of New Jersey. 5 You just don't -- just like this 6 area here. There is a code. Sprinklers. 7 See? Sprinklers. 8 COMMISSIONER CHOFFO: Mr. 9 Chairman, based on the fact at the last 10 meeting the applicant, Mr. Curly's 11 application, the Board had requested five 12 items and the applicant basically has agreed 13 to and provided all five items, so on that 14 note I would like to make a motion to approve 15 this application. 16 COMMISSIONER DIDOMENICO: 17 Second. 18 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Do we 19 have a motion? 20 DIRECTOR MARKS: Mr. Chairman, 21 there is a motion on the floor made by 22 Commissioner Choffo, seconded by Commissioner 23 DiDomenico to approve application 2007-078-SP. 24 On the motion, Commissioner 25 Arencibia? 78 1 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: Yes, 2 with the conditions as I stated. 3 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 4 Bettinger? 5 COMMISSIONER BETTINGER: No. 6 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 7 Choffo? 8 COMMISSIONER CHOFFO: Yes. 9 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 10 DiDomenico? 11 COMMISSIONER DIDOMENICO: Yes. 12 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 13 Holloway? 14 COMMISSIONER HOLLOWAY: Yes. I 15 would like to make a comment. 16 After thinking about this over 17 the month, the dilemma that Hoboken has with 18 the traffic, it is tremendous, and me myself 19 probably would never put a theater that had 20 that many people on the site and I do 21 understand you are not going to be able to 22 stop everybody from dropping off people, you 23 are going to have a problem there. 24 You are probably going to have 25 to have police officers there when the movie 79 1 theaters open, but I do understand where 2 Hoboken is coming from with this so I vote 3 yes. 4 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 5 Mehta? 6 COMMISSIONER MEHTA: I will 7 support and I have the same feeling like 8 Commissioner Holloway, but as I suggested that 9 please include the bicycle rack to accommodate 10 more patrons who wants to walk or use the 11 bicycle and I know the Hoboken community. 12 I know the future wants to go 13 and the Hoboken local government doesn't have 14 a problem. I will say yes. 15 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 16 Munoz? 17 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: No. 18 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commission Ng? 19 COMMISSIONER NG: No. 20 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 21 Fitzgibbons? 22 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Yes. 23 DIRECTOR MARKS: Six votes in 24 the affirmative and three votes in the 25 negative. The motion passes. 80 1 MR. CURLEY: Thank you. 2 DIRECTOR MARKS: Mr. Chairman, 3 the next application scheduled for public 4 hearing is 2008-021-SP, Dennis M. Devino. 5 Applicant is located at 605-607 Willow Avenue 6 which is Block 168, Lot 2 in the City of 7 Hoboken. 8 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Ready. 9 MR. LEANZA: My name is Frank 10 Leanza, L-E-A-N-Z-A. 11 I represent the applicant which 12 is Maria Louisa, LLC. The property address is 13 605-607 Willow Avenue and I guess to start off 14 with I would like to have our architect Dennis 15 Devino sworn and he can give you background of 16 what the building looks like and it is grade, 17 it is not an artist rendering. This is a 18 picture of what is actually up in there. 19 Do you want to swear in Mr. 20 Devino? 21 ATTORNEY CALVANICO: State your 22 name, spell your last name for the record. 23 MR. DEVINO: Dennis Devino, 24 D-E-V-I-N-O, Jersey City. 25 (Dennis Devino was duly sworn.) 81 1 MR. LEANZA: Mr. Devino, would 2 you be so kind, why don't you start off and 3 give us -- I will first qualify him as an 4 expert. 5 Give us just he briefly some of 6 your educational background. 7 You are licensed in the State of 8 New Jersey as a registered architect, some of 9 your vocational background, and you can go 10 ahead and explain it to the members of the 11 Planning Board. 12 MR. DEVINO: I graduated NJIT in 13 New Jersey, I was licensed in the State of New 14 Jersey in 1984, licensed in the State of 15 Pennsylvania 1986, State of New York in 1989. 16 Been practicing architecture in 17 Hudson County for about the last ten years, 18 about 1997. 19 I worked in Hoboken. My office 20 right now is on Garfield Avenue in Jersey City 21 and I have about four employees right now and 22 we have been doing architecture in Jersey City 23 and Hoboken, like I said, for ten years. 24 I have been before this Board a 25 number of times as well as Jersey City and 82 1 Hoboken Planning Board and zoning boards. 2 I am also a licensed planner. 3 That's it. 4 MR. LEANZA: Good enough. I 5 guess you accept his credentials. 6 Why don't you explain the 7 building, the construction, the units and 8 where it is located. 9 MR. DEVINO: The property in 10 question is 605-607 Willow. It sits on a 43 11 by 100 site. 12 Prior to designing and 13 construction of the project, there was a fully 14 asphalt parking lot which housed about 16 to 15 18 cars which had a curb cut. 16 We designed and constructed the 17 building as of right. There are eight units. 18 Four face the rear of the lot and four face 19 the front of Willow Avenue. 20 The rear units all have 21 balconies and the front units all share kind 22 of a common bay which you see quite often 23 designed in Hoboken. 24 The building meets all the 25 ordinance requirements of the city of Hoboken; 83 1 the facade ordinance, the proportion of brick, 2 glass, is all within the allowed or required 3 ordinance in Hoboken. 4 As you can see -- I would like 5 to kind of basically point out that this is, 6 this was really a well designed program. This 7 was a very high end building. 8 On the inside it was a well 9 designed lobby. 10 So as I take you through the way 11 the site or the front of the building was 12 designed, it accentuates what we did on the 13 inside. 14 It is a high-end building and we 15 want to make sure what we did in the front of 16 the building complemented what was done on the 17 inside of the building. 18 As you can see, we used brick 19 pavers accentuated by 18 by 18 granite slabs 20 for the sidewalk. 21 We also had granite, cut granite 22 curb as opposed to concrete curbs. 23 Our landscaping is a combination 24 of street trees and smaller shrubs. The 25 design of the landscaped shrub area 84 1 accentuates or complements the design of the 2 bays. 3 So the -- and the street 4 material, the material in the building that we 5 used from the ground level to the first floor 6 living is about ten feet of limestone. 7 So you can see we used very high 8 quality materials throughout the whole 9 building as well as the streetscape itself. 10 MR. LEANZA: Mr. Devino, a 11 question to ask you, the drainage for this 12 facility. Does it go into a county drain 13 system or local municipal drain system? 14 MR. DEVINO: The drainage both 15 storm and sanitary -- Hoboken has a combined 16 sewer system. Sanitary and storm go to the 17 same place. And it all goes to Hudson County 18 Regional Sewerage Authority. 19 MR. LEANZA: North Hudson 20 County. 21 MR. DEVINO: North Hudson, which 22 is not a county facility. 23 MR. LEANZA: Next question is 24 with regard to traffic. 25 You mentioned there was an 85 1 existing building there with 16 parking spaces 2 and a curb cut. 3 Did you use the same curb cut? 4 MR. DEVINO: Yes, we did. 5 MR. LEANZA: And from 16 spaces 6 to 8 spaces? 7 MR. DEVINO: Eight spots located 8 within the curb. 9 MR. LEANZA: So the traffic 10 should be half of what it was before? 11 MR. DEVINO: Should be less. 12 MR. LEANZA: If anything, it is 13 a positive impact on traffic? 14 MR. DEVINO: Correct. 15 MR. LEANZA: No drainage and no 16 traffic in your opinion as a professional? 17 MR. DEVINO: Yes. 18 MR. LEANZA: The next question I 19 would like to address is some of the issues 20 that were pointed out in some of the reviews I 21 received from the county, one of which was a 22 reference to New Jersey residential site 23 improvement requirements with regards to 24 parking spaces and I would like Mr. Devino to 25 address that, particularly resolution 98.3 of 86 1 the New Jersey Site Improvement Advisory Board 2 which exempted Hoboken from the general state 3 requirements and I think Mr. Devino will 4 testify that according to the site improvement 5 regulations as approved by the State of New 6 Jersey with respect to Hoboken, that this 7 building doesn't need any spaces at all. I 8 have my copy. 9 MR. DEVINO: I have it. 10 To begin with. The building is 11 very much consistent as far as parking 12 requirements with everything else in Hoboken. 13 The State passed Resolution 98-3 14 which essentially exempts Hoboken from the 15 state standards and allowed Hoboken, because 16 it is the type, the city, the city environment 17 and the requirement of the street parking 18 throughout Hoboken, they have their own 19 parking requirements and those parking 20 requirements, if you are 50 feet or less on 21 your frontage of your lot you don't have to 22 provide any spots. 23 If you are over 50 feet you get 24 actually exempt for the first five and then 25 anything, the first five units. 87 1 It is one to one essentially and 2 anything over the first five you are required 3 to put again one to one. 4 So eight units theoretically if 5 it was required would require three spots and 6 we have eight. 7 So we are already over the 8 requirement if it was over 50 foot wide lot so 9 there are plenty of parking spots and 10 essentially the resolution, you want me to 11 submit this as evidence? 12 MR. LEANZA: If they want to 13 take it, Mr. Calvanico? 14 MR. CALVANICO: I will take it. 15 MR. LEANZA: I would like to 16 reemphasize for the record Mr. Devino already 17 testified there was no Planning Board or 18 Zoning Board approval required for this 19 project, it is basically as an in-fill as a 20 matter of right. It means all existing 21 planning and zoning ordinance requirements in 22 Hoboken. 23 Next matter I would like to 24 address which is guess is No. 6, the applicant 25 shall obtain Freeholder Board approval for the 88 1 planter box in front of the building which is 2 an accounting right of way. 3 Maybe you could -- 4 COMMISSIONER HOLLOWAY: If you 5 could speak into the mike. 6 MR. LEANZA: The initial 7 issue -- 8 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Come up 9 closer and speak. 10 MR. LEANZA: I will yell. 11 The next issue that was 12 addressed is as discussed by Mr. Devino in 13 front of the building is a planter box which 14 matches both the facade as well as the facade 15 in the front of the building as well as the 16 streetscape and I will ask Mr. Devino to 17 reference the survey which has how much it 18 extends out into the county right of way. 19 MR. DEVINO: The planter box we 20 are referring to, I guess you can see it here 21 in the plan, is this section right here 22 (indicating) and if you look at it in the 23 photograph it would be behind this fence area 24 right here. 25 I also have some photos that are 89 1 a bit more -- 2 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Can we 3 see them? 4 MR. LEANZA: Of course. 5 MR. DEVINO: Of course 6 (handing). 7 That planter box extends past 8 the building approximately 7.2 feet. 9 And as you can see from this, 10 there are a lot of reasons now why we put 11 protection around plantings and I guess for 12 obvious reasons which I believe will be a 13 little bit more specific later on is this 14 approximately thirty-inch rail from grade up 15 and it is designed again to protect the 16 plantings. 17 MR. LEANZA: And you designed 18 this planter box and you were the one who had 19 input as to how far it was going to extend out 20 into the right of way and you had some 21 reasoning behind it. I know you have some 22 pictures. 23 Why don't you explain it to the 24 Board. 25 MR. DEVINO: I missed my que on 90 1 that. 2 MR. LEANZA: You have my 3 pictures, too. 4 MR. DEVINO: I will also submit 5 this one if I may, showing the planter box. 6 The specific distance away from 7 the building was to align with some of the -- 8 with the majority of the stoops along that 9 side of Willow Avenue. 10 There is an adjacent stoop on 11 the building right next door here that comes 12 out actually a little bit more than our 13 planter box. 14 So to keep that walk line 15 consistent, that was essentially the point at 16 which -- the judging point of which, how far 17 we wanted to bring that planter box out. 18 MR. LEANZA: In your opinion 19 that planter box is not, does not extend into 20 the right of way any more than any other 21 planter box or stoop which is -- some other 22 are made of concrete and brick and affected 23 the whole block? 24 MR. DEVINO: It extends out less 25 than the adjacent protrusion out into the 91 1 right of way. 2 We felt it was conservative 3 modest and it also kept the line of site 4 proper and also for pedestrians to walk, it 5 kept everything consistent for the walking 6 path. 7 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: They 8 still have to get an approval for the Board of 9 Freeholders, right? 10 MR. LEANZA: Can I address that? 11 Your resolution enables the 12 Planning Board -- it says the County Planning 13 Board may waive or adjust the right of way 14 with requirements wherein such areas as 15 developed commercial districts or heavily 16 built up residential neighborhoods, buildings, 17 walls or other structures have been 18 constructed within the proposed right of way 19 prior to the enactment of this resolution to a 20 point where the alteration is or removal would 21 be impractical and I believe we are saying the 22 whole block extends out beyond the 7.2 foot 23 planter and if that is the case, the way I 24 read this resolution, you fellows and ladies 25 have jurisdiction to allow it. 92 1 COMMISSIONER HOLLOWAY: I have 2 one question, Mr. Chairman. 3 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: 4 Commissioner Holloway. 5 COMMISSIONER HOLLOWAY: 6 Regarding your property, you have two or three 7 planters that have a tree in the middle of it. 8 MR. DEVINO: There are two 9 street trees, yes, sir. 10 MR. LEANZA: We are going to 11 address them later. That was another point 12 that was in examination by our county 13 personnel, those of the tree guards, and we 14 will address those later, sir. 15 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: Mr. 16 Chairman? 17 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Yes. 18 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: These 19 items, where you are going to build? 20 COMMISSIONER HOLLOWAY: It is 21 already up? This is up already? 22 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: So this 23 application is basically for what? 24 MR. LEANZA: To approve it. The 25 applicant, understanding that the jurisdiction 93 1 of this County Planning Board was with regard 2 to drainage and traffic, was under the 3 assumption since there were no drainage or 4 traffic problems they didn't have to get a 5 County Planning Board application and the 6 County moved before Judge Giampoli and Judge 7 Giampoli said we had to come here for a 8 Planning Board application so we made the 9 application and we are here. 10 COMMISSIONER BETTINGER: The 11 building is already built? 12 MR. LEANZA: It is built and 13 occupied. It is a condominium and all of the 14 units have been sold and are occupied. 15 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: Based on 16 any impact from the county drainage, what is 17 the impact? 18 MR. LEANZA: It can't, because 19 there is no county drainage here. 20 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: Fine. I 21 just want to hear it. 22 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: The 23 sewer is owned by North Hudson Sewer 24 Authority, so the county has no sewers over 25 there. 94 1 We own the street, but the 2 drainage is -- really it hasn't changed from 3 what it was previously. 4 MR. LEANZA: Correct. 5 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: So the 6 sewers are still the same. 7 MR. DEVINO: May I add, all the 8 improvements that were done in the street and 9 in the sidewalk we actually filed application 10 and permits for that with the county. 11 Street opening permits were 12 filed with the county as well as well the work 13 that was done for the curbing and the 14 sidewalks was done with the county. That is 15 actually on file, so that has been done. 16 MR. LEANZA: To the extent they 17 have the plants and trees there, it would be 18 able to absorb more water there. 19 If anything, there is an 20 improvement to the drainage. 21 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: Let me ask 22 you, is there a place to plant more trees? 23 MR. LEANZA: No, not really, 24 because if you plant more trees that will be 25 our next topic, the trees would be in the way 95 1 of a car opening the door. 2 One of the points that were made 3 was that the tree guards might disrupt traffic 4 or might disrupt car openings and they were 5 strategically located because there was a 6 driveway. 7 The first tree guard is right in 8 front of the driveway not so it interferes 9 turning in, but the front of somebody's car is 10 where the engine is so the door would open 11 past the tree guard and the next one is in the 12 back where the back of the car would be so it 13 won't hurt anybody and I am going to now 14 address this issue with Mr. Devino because the 15 review letter talked about some sort of 16 handicapped accessible-type tree guard and 17 that is really, we don't think appropriate in 18 Hoboken. 19 One of our big problems is there 20 appears to be more dogs now than people. 21 People walk their dog and if these tree guards 22 were accessible to handicapped people -- I 23 would have no idea why somebody would want to 24 go over tree guards with holes with a 25 wheelchair. 96 1 They are also accessible targets 2 to dogs who tend to urinate and defecate on 3 trees which is their nature, and I know Mr. 4 Devino has looked into this when we got 5 involved in it and he did some studies on what 6 is done in New York and the type of tree 7 guards that are recommended there, and the 8 tree guards we have are exactly as recommended 9 by the City of New York. 10 I will ask Mr. Devino to expand 11 on it. 12 COMMISSIONER HOLLOWAY: Mr. 13 Chairman, if I may. 14 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Yes, 15 Commissioner. 16 COMMISSIONER HOLLOWAY: The 17 photos that the Commissioners have, on the 18 picture there is a gentleman trying to get out 19 of his vehicle. 20 I don't know if you are aware of 21 this, and it looks like the car door passes 22 the box but it is going to be difficult for 23 him to get through the guard rail and not to 24 go around. 25 Do you see what I am talking 97 1 about? 2 MR. DEVINO: That is his fault. 3 He should have parked in front. 4 COMMISSIONER HOLLOWAY: But he 5 didn't. 6 MR. LEANZA: But it looks like 7 he is not parked here, it looks like he is 8 dropping off something. 9 Look how he is more than 6 10 inches from the curb. 11 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: Is that a 12 county road? 13 MR. LEANZA: Mr. Chairman, here 14 is how people should be following -- 15 MR. DEVINO: If I may address 16 that photo that the counselor just gave to the 17 chairman, what was mentioned earlier was that 18 these trees were strategically located so when 19 you park your first car, the bumper -- you 20 obviously can't design it for every single car 21 and every single vehicle when you park a car 22 up to the edge of the access drive, both doors 23 will be between the two trees and two tree 24 guards so you can essentially open both doors 25 pretty freely without bumping into trees and 98 1 again I have a section that I would like to 2 read into the record from a company, a 3 nonprofit organization called About Trees New 4 York which essentially identifies how 5 important and essential tree guards really 6 are. 7 If I may, Mr. Chairman. 8 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Yes. 9 MR. DEVINO: This is from a 10 company, nonprofit that pretty much handles 11 protecting the street trees in Manhattan. 12 It is called About Trees New 13 York and it starts off by saying New York City 14 street trees provide shade, clean air and 15 beauty to our public right of way. The 16 congested thoroughfare of our cities are, 17 however, quite hazardous to trees. 18 Automobiles, toxic chemicals, 19 dogs, bikes and even pedestrians threaten the 20 health of our city trees. 21 Installing tree pit guards 22 around trees, street trees, is an effective 23 way to protect the health of city trees. 24 When designed properly, tree pit 25 guards mitigate the hazards faced by trees in 99 1 the city. 2 A tree pit guard is a low fence 3 usually made of wood or iron that is installed 4 at the edge of the tree pit. 5 About Trees New York which again 6 is the nonprofit, strongly encourages the 7 installation of well designed tree guards to 8 protect street trees and it goes on with 9 reasons why. 10 This is obviously a good tree 11 pit guard, prevents dogs from depositing waste 12 on tree trunks and around tree pits. 13 Dog urine is acid and the feces 14 are high in nitrates. Both are harmful to 15 trees. Prevents pedestrians from stepping on 16 the soils of the pits. Foot traffic can 17 compact the soil and restrict the air and soil 18 to the tree roots. Allows for planting of 19 flowers and ground cover around the pits. 20 Protects a tree from mechanical damage caused 21 by car doors, bumpers, bike locks and other 22 sidewalk traffic. Prevents chemical salts and 23 other toxic, toxins, from flowing into the 24 tree pits and again it goes on and on. 25 Just going to summarize, the 100 1 tree pit guard must not, and I will just go 2 through restrictions, hinder the growth of the 3 trees, raise the level of the soiling and it 4 must not pose a tripping hazard. 5 Make sure that your pit guard is 6 large enough to be easily visible. The city 7 recommends a minimum height of 18 inches and 8 these are 21. 9 So we are well within certainly 10 what New York has done. New York has done 11 extensive studies on the reasons for pit 12 guards and why they should be used and I think 13 it was designed properly. 14 MR. LEANZA: And again it is not 15 only a New York -- I will ask you some -- here 16 are pictures of our pit guards and there are 17 even some across the street just south of 18 Willow Terrace. 19 I know the Chairman is familiar 20 across the street which is still on the county 21 road, the other side of Willow Avenue. 22 There are higher pit guards like 23 this and some on Hudson Avenue. I will 24 address it. 25 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: Mr. 101 1 Chairman? 2 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Yes. 3 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: I make a 4 motion to approve the application. 5 DIRECTOR MARKS: We are not done 6 with the hearing. 7 MR. LEANZA: I think we have an 8 obligation to address the comments. 9 Another comment was plans with 10 respect to a signature block for the county 11 planner or county engineer. And the citations 12 here, my understanding -- and I will defer it 13 to Board counsel -- but I think it only 14 requires a signature if and only if it is a 15 subdivision. 16 But we have plans ready to be 17 signed, in any event. This isn't a 18 subdivision. It is a simple site plan. 19 We have brought with us tonight 20 -- one of the other review questions was to 21 have as-built drawings. 22 The drawings that we have marked 23 are as-built. That is up to your counsel and 24 you if you want. 25 We will be happy to sign and 102 1 happy to give you the as-builts. We tried to 2 conform with the requirements in the letter 3 and where we deviated I hope we gave an 4 adequate explanation to the Board's 5 satisfaction. 6 If there are no other questions 7 we can rest and maybe Mr. Marks has some 8 questions. 9 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Yes? 10 DIRECTOR MARKS: Mr. Chairman, 11 for the Board's edification, this application, 12 as Mr. Leanza said, the building is complete. 13 It is occupied. 14 It actually comes to the Board 15 as a result of a lawsuit that Hudson County 16 had to file. 17 Judge Giampoli in his ruling 18 which is filed on January 2nd, revoked the 19 certificate of occupancy of this building and 20 directed the owners to file an application 21 with this Board and seek this Board's 22 approval. 23 With regard to the encroachments 24 within the county right of way, it may be true 25 that the Board has the jurisdiction to approve 103 1 the encroachments, however by custom and 2 practice we have always contacted the Board of 3 Chosen Freeholders about any encroachments 4 which occur within the county right of way. 5 The Freeholder Board has been 6 adamant about having those encroachments 7 reviewed and either a franchise or license 8 issued by the Board of Chosen Freeholders to 9 occupy county right of way. 10 MR. LEANZA: Could I address 11 that if you are finished? 12 DIRECTOR MARKS: No, I am not 13 finished. 14 With regard to the tree grade, 15 as you could see from the photographs of the 16 site inspection it appears that the tree 17 grade, it is more of a tree guard or tree 18 fence, actually impedes parking. 19 It also narrows the sidewalk 20 between the stoop and the street and thereby 21 decreasing the amount of right of way, and we 22 would request that the applicant -- had the 23 applicant gotten approval before the building 24 went up this could have been addressed and I 25 think the applicant should put in an ADA 104 1 accessible tree grade. 2 That is something in either -- 3 someone, I am sorry, in either a wheelchair or 4 a walker could pass over. 5 And my third item is just a 6 question for Mr. Leanza. Actually I have a 7 fourth item, too. 8 Mr. Leanza, when did this 9 building receive municipal -- it is always a 10 condition of the County Planning Board that 11 the applicants receive either state or 12 municipal approval, as necessary. 13 Mr. Leanza, when did this 14 building receive approval from the City of 15 Hoboken? 16 MR. LEANZA: It received a 17 certificate of zoning compliance from the 18 zoning officer, I am not familiar already with 19 the date. 20 Maybe Mr. Devino is. 21 MR. DEVINO: I have another 22 file. 23 MR. LEANZA: That was a 24 condition of the building permit. We couldn't 25 get a building permit until we go to the 105 1 building department office with the zoning 2 certificate. That's the way Hoboken works. 3 DIRECTOR MARKS: Mr. Chairman, 4 because of the nature of this application and 5 the way it came before this Board and the fact 6 it is fully up and occupied, in taking a look 7 at Hoboken's zoning ordinance it also appears 8 to me that there were seven variances required 9 for this property. 10 So just in light of that I would 11 like to know from Mr. Leanza how it was able 12 to pass through either Municipal Planning 13 Board approval or get the approval of the 14 Zoning Board. 15 MR. LEANZA: The zoning officer 16 had a different opinion than you and concluded 17 that there were no variances required from the 18 City of Hoboken zoning ordinance. 19 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: You are 20 saying that the zoning officer signed off on 21 it? 22 MR. LEANZA: Yes. 23 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: And he 24 has the legal right to do that? 25 MR. LEANZA: That is the only 106 1 way we were able to proceed. 2 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: I will 3 ask the attorney, does the zoning officer have 4 a right to sign off on that project? 5 ATTORNEY CALVANICO: Yes, that 6 is the zoning officer's job. 7 MR. DEVINO: Mr. Chairman, I 8 made application to the zoning official and 9 submitted a set of drawings exactly what we 10 were doing and got approval from the zoning 11 department but I also would like to add that 12 the permits were issued by Weehawken by Mr. 13 Frank Tattoli, not by the City of Hoboken, by 14 the City of Weehawken. 15 I want to put that on the record 16 and again it was approved by the zoning 17 officer. 18 So we had no reason, and 19 certainly in my opinion and analysis of this 20 project it was an as of right project. 21 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: Mr. 22 Chairman? 23 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Yes. 24 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: What is ADA 25 approved tree guard rails? 107 1 DIRECTOR MARKS: With regard to 2 the tree grades, one, they impede anybody 3 getting in and out of a car and they severely 4 limit parking along the frontage and, two, if 5 you have a person who is either in a 6 wheelchair or somebody who is visually impared 7 and is using a cane or, three, somebody who is 8 elderly and using a walker, it creates a pinch 9 point in the, on the sidewalk. 10 And just to be consistent with 11 other sites around the county, there are 12 essentially flat tree grades which allow 13 infiltration of water and air but are also 14 passable to anybody with a wheelchair or a 15 walker or anybody who is physically impaired 16 and that creates basically an impediment for 17 people to get by. 18 MR. DEVINO: Mr. Chairman, with 19 all due with respect to the counselor, I am 20 licensed by three states to make those types 21 of decisions and this is well within -- what 22 we should -- say barrier free requirements. 23 MR. LEANZA: Moreso than that. 24 If you look at the sidewalk layout, the 25 sidewalk where people would walk not where the 108 1 planter is and not where the tree guards is, 2 is marked a different color. Almost like a 3 yellow brick road right down the street. 4 MR. DEVINO: Sixty-eight and a 5 half inches between the tree grade and the 6 grade around the landscaping. 7 A landscaped ramp is only 8 required to have 48 inches, I believe, so it 9 is well within an allowable distance for two 10 wheelchairs to pass through. 11 MR. LEANZA: And we already had 12 testimony from Mr. Devino as to the benefits 13 of having a tree guard such as this to keep 14 animals away. 15 And one of the things we want to 16 do is protect the tree from door openings, and 17 Mr. Devino and the applicant went through the 18 trouble of locating these tree guards so it 19 would be virtually impossible if somebody 20 parked where somebody normally would with the 21 front of the car right in front of the 22 driveway, the first tree grade was, as I said 23 before, would be by the front tire. There 24 would be enough room to open the door and the 25 other tree grade would be by the back of the 109 1 car, so it really shouldn't impede or scratch 2 any car. 3 MR. DEVINO: And lastly, 4 logically if somebody is visually impaired and 5 has a cane, the higher the obstruction the 6 better it is for the cane to hit. The lower 7 the structure the higher chance to hit it. 8 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: I do have 9 a question. 10 I have seen the picture where 11 this other obstruction is on Willow Avenue. 12 Almost the same type. I just see the picture. 13 Did you see the picture? 14 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: I want to 15 see the other pictures. 16 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: You can't 17 be discriminatory. 18 COMMISSIONER CHOFFO: What was 19 the date of completion? 20 MR. DEVINO: I think July of 21 possibly '06, somewhere around there. 22 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: Are these 23 ADA compliant? 24 DIRECTOR MARKS: I would have to 25 check, Mr. Chairman. It is really site 110 1 specific so it depends on how wide the 2 sidewalk is. 3 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: I want to 4 see what the compliance would be. It means 5 that the borders instead of being pointy 6 borders, they are going to be round? 7 I don't understand. 8 ATTORNEY CALVANICO: Flat on to 9 the ground, it is like a grade on the ground 10 surrounding the tree. 11 MR. LEANZA: Which I have 12 tripped over many times. There are a lot of 13 other places in Hoboken and they have to let 14 air and water through and if you are 15 handicapped, Mr. Devino's opinion would be, as 16 well, nobody with a wheelchair is going to go 17 over them. And my wife wouldn't go over it in 18 high heels either. 19 And the City of New York 20 recommends as well, too, this barrier, so 21 people don't walk into to it. 22 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: I make a 23 motion for approval. 24 DIRECTOR MARKS: I still have 25 one. 111 1 COMMISSIONER MEHTA: This 2 project from day one -- 3 MR. DEVINO: Yes. 4 COMMISSIONER MEHTA: In your 5 testimony you said that you are practicing 6 architecture and planning for more than ten 7 years and you appeared in front of this Board 8 on numerous time also. 9 MR. DEVINO: Yes, sir. 10 COMMISSIONER MEHTA: So you are 11 aware that it is a county road, right? 12 MR. DEVINO: Yes, sir. 13 COMMISSIONER MEHTA: So just 14 give me explanation why you did not file the 15 application in front of the County Planning 16 Board before the project started. 17 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Can I 18 defer? There was a court case and it was 19 brought, the county actually brought it to 20 court, am I right? 21 DIRECTOR MARKS: That is 22 correct, Mr. Chairman, but the applicant was 23 told during the course as well as the 24 construction code official in Hoboken that it 25 was a county road at several points and the 112 1 applicant refused to file an application until 2 compelled by the Superior Court judge. 3 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Did they 4 rectify that? 5 DIRECTOR MARKS: As a result of 6 Judge Giampoli's ruling filed on January 2nd 7 they are here. 8 MR. LEANZA: Even though we 9 didn't file the site plan application, we did 10 file for street openings and we did have 11 somebody from the county who came and 12 inspected when we rebuilt the curb cut in the 13 same position. 14 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: Didn't that 15 happen with a couple of properties? It is not 16 something that they did -- 17 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: They are 18 saying the permits that they had were 19 permissible by the county, is that right? 20 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: I don't 21 know if -- usually we don't issue permits 22 until they get Planning Board approval, so I 23 am not aware. 24 DIRECTOR MARKS: I don't know 25 how that is possible, Mr. Chairman. 113 1 Also for Mr. Devino, on the site 2 plans there is no table for what the variances 3 are and -- not the variances, what the 4 municipal ordinances are and what is proposed. 5 MR. LEANZA: Is that a 6 requirement of this Planning Board? 7 DIRECTOR MARKS: No, but I am 8 interested in that. This is a highly unusual 9 application. 10 MR. LEANZA: The reason it is 11 not there is because the plans weren't drawn 12 for a planning board, the plans were given to 13 the zoning officer, and the zoning officer 14 determined there were no variances necessary, 15 that is why there is no table. 16 DIRECTOR MARKS: Mr. Chairman, 17 if the Board approved this application I would 18 request or make it a condition of approval 19 that they furnish the appropriate approvals 20 that they say they have gotten from the county 21 and say they have gotten with the 22 municipality. 23 MR. LEANZA: No problem. We 24 have from the zoning official and we have cash 25 and checks of what we paid the county. 114 1 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Are they 2 current checks or are they -- 3 MR. LEANZA: During 4 construction. 5 Now, it was build two years ago. 6 But we paid all applications fees and they all 7 came in with the application. 8 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: But you 9 can provide that evidence? 10 MR. DEVINO: There were 11 inspections done, I believe. I submitted a 12 letter initially when we submitted the 13 application of the inspection, the county 14 inspector that did the inspections of the 15 curbs and sidewalks and I have, actually I 16 have a copy of the cancelled checks when we 17 did the curbs and sidewalks and I am sure I 18 can get the rest. 19 COMMISSIONER MEHTA: Mr. 20 Chairman? 21 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Yes. 22 COMMISSIONER MEHTA: I wondered, 23 you didn't answer my question yet. 24 Was the applicant required to 25 give explanation as to why they did not file 115 1 the application in front of the County 2 Planning Board two years ago? 3 MR. DEVINO: Sir, I apologize, 4 but I was under the impression it was not 5 required. 6 For one reason we didn't have to 7 go to city planning approval and second we had 8 no drainage or no traffic issues, so I just 9 figured all we needed to do was submit, when 10 we did the road opening, permits and when we 11 did the sidewalk work. 12 I was apparently mistaken, 13 that's why we are here and I do apologize for 14 that. 15 COMMISSIONER MEHTA: You also 16 mentioned you came in front of the Board for 17 numerous times and the last ten years you are 18 in your profession. 19 Any time there is a county 20 property, the county road is adjoined to the 21 property county, the applicant has to be in 22 front of the County Board. 23 MR. DEVINO: Yes, sir. We have 24 -- I was here. It was always because I had 25 gotten municipal approval and then of course I 116 1 would come back and get county approval. 2 I truthfully had no projects on 3 a county road that I did not have to seek 4 Municipal Board approval first, so it was -- I 5 apologize. I -- 6 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: You cost 7 the county some money on that court case, 8 that's what we are mad about. 9 COMMISSIONER MEHTA: Can we get 10 reimbursement from the applicant? 11 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: No. 12 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: I have a 13 couple applications coming with the same 14 situation, so we would be discriminatory to 15 hold the applicants when we have approval 16 applications with the same and we haven't held 17 them to that standard. 18 MR. DEVINO: There would be no 19 reason for us not to come to the county. It 20 was a cut and dry application. It was just an 21 oversight. 22 We were proud of the site plan 23 and site work that we did. There wouldn't be 24 any reason that we wouldn't come here. It is 25 not like you we are going to say no. 117 1 COMMISSIONER MEHTA: We are not 2 denying we will say no or yes. The only thing 3 is it bothers me as a County Planning Board 4 person, Commissioner, that instead of 5 following the protocol and do the application 6 in proper manner, you do everything after the 7 fact. 8 MR. DEVINO: It bothers me too 9 as a professional. I do apologize. I do not 10 want to be here and put myself in this 11 position of not having to do this before the 12 building was constructed. 13 COMMISSIONER HOLLOWAY: This 14 building is up, occupied. 15 What are my issues? I would 16 like to find out which inspector inspected 17 this piece of property and did we actually 18 accept money from them without them coming 19 before this Board. 20 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: If he 21 has got proof -- 22 MR. DEVINO: There is a letter I 23 wrote on December 26 that gives the 24 inspector's name and I also have a copy of the 25 cancelled check for that work. 118 1 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: This was 2 after the building was up. 3 MR. DEVINO: Yes, that was after 4 the building was up and we were doing the site 5 work. 6 We will produce the road opening 7 permits. I don't have those with me. 8 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Give this 9 to him. That's his department. 10 MR. LEANZA: Pass the buck. 11 (Commissioner Arencibia perusing 12 documents.) 13 COMMISSIONER MEHTA: Mr. 14 Chairman, I would like to hear our attorney's 15 opinion what are the remedy or what is 16 supposed to be the position of the County 17 Planning Board in this case. 18 ATTORNEY CALVANICO: Sorry? 19 COMMISSIONER MEHTA: What is 20 your recommendation after the Judge Giampoli's 21 request and after the case? 22 ATTORNEY CALVANICO: The judge 23 required that they come here, they have done 24 that. 25 The Board is certainly -- has 119 1 its right to impose whatever conditions at the 2 time it would have made an application. 3 COMMISSIONER MEHTA: Does it 4 have any penalty or anything that can be 5 imposed? 6 ATTORNEY CALVANICO: This Board 7 does not have the authority to do that. The 8 Planning Board doesn't have the authority to 9 impose a penalty. 10 The County can propose remedies. 11 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: The reason 12 the Board is here is to see what kind of 13 effect any construction will put in a county 14 road. 15 I don't think we need to 16 penalize anyone. 17 If this application had been 18 coming before us we would have approved it. 19 It is a clean approval. 20 They have parking spaces. It is 21 a nice building. I agree with the guard rails 22 for the trees. That is a new idea. They went 23 out of their way spending money to put that in 24 there. 25 I mean the building, looking at 120 1 the picture, it looks -- I like the way it is 2 constructed so they apologized for not putting 3 that application before and I think a lot is 4 -- not only then, I think Hoboken had the same 5 issue. We have approved some of those 6 applications in the past so we will be 7 discriminatory to not approve them because of 8 that reason. 9 We didn't put a penalty on 10 previous applications. We don't need to talk 11 about penalties. 12 And I make a motion to approve 13 the application. 14 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: On a 15 motion, do we have a second? 16 (Pause in proceedings.) 17 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Do we 18 have to pull the application? 19 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: Mr. 20 Chairman, if I could just suggest that if 21 there is an approval, that the application 22 does go to the Board of Freeholders for the 23 encroachment. It is just to be consistent 24 with every other application. 25 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: I will make 121 1 a motion to also include that. 2 COMMISSIONER CHOFFO: I was 3 going to reiterate the same thing Commissioner 4 Arencibia said. 5 Just to correct Mr. Leanza, I 6 have been on this Board for about eight years 7 now and every application that has come in 8 front of us, the Planning Board, has always 9 moved the request to get approval from the 10 County Freeholders. 11 MR. LEANZA: I am telling you, 12 you don't have to. It has been said. 13 I just want to address what Mr. 14 Mehta said, and he was correct that the 15 applicant should have been here and he is 16 worried about a penalty. 17 Mr. Devino has already said mea 18 culpa. And not only that, he said he was not 19 going to charge us for his time. 20 So he is the one that is paying 21 the penalty. 22 COMMISSIONER MEHTA: My only 23 concern, not a financial penalty like at the 24 same time. Because the court case definitely 25 -- the County occurred some financial burden. 122 1 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: We have a 2 motion on the floor by Commissioner Munoz. 3 Do we have a second? 4 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: Mr. 5 Chairman, just one more thing on the issue 6 with the tree guards. 7 Is the county -- my office has 8 not installed these types of tree guards 9 before. 10 We normally install the ADA tree 11 guards which have the trees at the same level 12 as the sidewalk, and that protects the trees. 13 As these photos show they are 14 too close to the curb and a door from a car 15 will be, may hit or even the car just parking 16 and the angle of the car backing in will back 17 into the tree guard. 18 So I think from a standpoint of 19 liability, I think the county should not 20 accept these type of tree guards even though 21 there are some on our roadways that have been 22 put in without approvals from us, but I think 23 for consistency we should always go with the 24 ADA accessible tree guards. 25 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: The 123 1 applicant has any concern? 2 MR. LEANZA: Does the County 3 have any standards of these? Because again 4 your jurisdiction is limited to traffic 5 issues. 6 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: We have 7 standards on the tree guards. 8 MR. LEANZA: Have they been 9 passed by the Board of Freeholders? 10 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: ADA 11 approved. 12 MR. LEANZA: I will go over it 13 with Mr. Calvanico. 14 Your jurisdiction is limited 15 only to -- such review and approval shall be 16 in conformance with procedures and standards 17 adopted by resolution or ordinance as 18 appropriate of the governing body, so what I 19 am saying is if there is nothing published by 20 the Board of Freeholders as standards for 21 these tree guards, and I know that there 22 isn't, as a matter of fact, your resolution 23 says when you are constructing sidewalks 24 within the county right of way they are not 25 required by the county. And that I believe 124 1 all you have of record. 2 Now, I am not saying that people 3 don't have to put in sidewalks, but I am 4 saying if we are going to quibble on the 5 technicalities of a so-called ADA planter or 6 something that my client spent extra time and 7 money, did extra research, and as the Chairman 8 noted. This is probably more appropriate with 9 the way Hoboken is changing almost becoming 10 the sixth borough of New York, I am going to 11 raise a technicality that since you don't have 12 a standard that is published by the Board of 13 Freeholders, you can't impose a standard from 14 outside. 15 I got a question for Steve. 16 DIRECTOR MARKS: Mr. Chairman, I 17 respectfully -- 18 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: I got a 19 question for you. 20 DIRECTOR MARKS: Sure. 21 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Did we 22 ever on the County Planning Board request that 23 these tree guards be made -- this is all new 24 to me with these tree guards. 25 Did we ever on any project that 125 1 came before us request that they be tree 2 guards at certain specifications? 3 DIRECTOR MARKS: Mr. Chairman, 4 the tree guards which are part of this 5 application, I do not recall, but I don't 6 think that this Board has seen other 7 applications with this kind of a tree guard. 8 It does appear going out and 9 doing a site inspection, it does appear to 10 impede car doors of people who are parking 11 along the street, and that is a concern. 12 The parking is at a crunch, it 13 is at a premium as it is, and to essentially 14 eliminate or reduce the amount of parkable 15 area by the addition of these tree guards is a 16 concern. 17 I also respectfully disagree 18 with Mr. Leanza. This Board, this is a county 19 road, it is a county right of way. This Board 20 has jurisdiction. 21 It may not be automobile traffic 22 that this Board is concerned with, it also 23 could be pedestrian traffic and circulation, 24 so when Mr. Leanza tells you that this Board 25 doesn't have jurisdiction, I don't agree with 126 1 him. I don't accept that. 2 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Do we 3 have -- 4 MR. LEANZA: May I say 5 something? 6 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: No, you 7 may not. I am speaking. 8 MR. LEANZA: Thanks, Mr. 9 Chairman Fitzgibbons. Thanks, Jude. 10 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Do we 11 have any specs that the county enforces on 12 that? 13 DIRECTOR MARKS: The county uses 14 NJDOT specifications. It is -- if it is not 15 specifically written out within our site plan 16 and subdivision review, then we by and large 17 accept and recommend NJDOT specifications. 18 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Because 19 the way things are going in all these 20 municipalities in Hudson County, there is 21 going to be a lot of trees being planted. A 22 lot of trees going to be planted. 23 DIRECTOR MARKS: You want tree 24 guards and tree grades which protect the trees 25 and also allow for pedestrian, appropriate 127 1 pedestrians circulation that also do not 2 impede car doors when people are parking along 3 our roadways. 4 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: What is the 5 difference between that tree guard and the one 6 that they have? 7 DIRECTOR MARKS: Mr. Chairman, I 8 don't know where that tree guard is located. 9 That which was furnished, it is not signed, it 10 is not sealed, there is no address on it. 11 I have no idea where the tree 12 guard came from. 13 MR. LEANZA: Across the street. 14 DIRECTOR MARKS: I don't think 15 that tree guard was part of a development that 16 was approved by this Board, either. 17 That's been a problem with 18 Hoboken. Hoboken has given away many 19 construction permits without, along county 20 roads without County Planning Board approval 21 and if the Board had before the project was 22 completed and constructed and now fully 23 occupied seen the site plans and the 24 specifications and were able to request before 25 the tree grades were installed that something 128 1 flat and more passable be installed, we 2 wouldn't be at this impasse right now. 3 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: If that 4 is across the street, the buildings are 100 5 years old. That is Willow Terrace, the side 6 of Willow Terrace. 7 DIRECTOR MARKS: I am not 8 familiar with that tree guard, Mr. Chairman. 9 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: I am not 10 familiar with it either. 11 COMMISSIONER HOLLOWAY: We 12 should try to end this, but does the applicant 13 have a problem of changing the guard? 14 Do you have a problem changing 15 it? 16 MR. LEANZA: I do. They spent a 17 lot of time and money and they have testimony 18 that says the way it is set up -- because you 19 have the driveway, somebody parks in front of 20 the driveway, the first tree guard is right by 21 the front of the car. You can open the door. 22 The second tree guard is by the 23 back of the guard. That is how things work. 24 Nobody loses. 25 COMMISSIONER HOLLOWAY: I 129 1 understand that. But going back -- and I hate 2 to do this -- if you had came in front of us 3 before you built this, those guards wouldn't 4 be there. 5 To be fair to this Board, we 6 must be fair to you. Give a little bit. All 7 we are asking for is to change the tree 8 guards. 9 MR. LEANZA: It is not my money 10 to give. 11 (Whereupon, an off-the-record 12 discussion was held.) 13 MR. LEANZA: The owner tends to 14 agree with me, number one, that there are 15 other tree guards of the same type along 16 county roads. 17 Why should he have to take this 18 down whether or not they were part of any 19 planning, and I take exception to Mr. Marks' 20 denouncing the City of Hoboken. 21 As Mr. Fitzgibbons points out, 22 the tree guard across the street that we have 23 the picture of wasn't part of any site plan. 24 Somebody cared about the tree 25 and spent a lot more money because that is a 130 1 better tree guard for the tree and it is clear 2 it protects it from animals, from dogs, from 3 bikes and from people opening car doors and 4 hitting the tree. 5 That is a danger, too, and also 6 from kids. 7 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Can I say 8 something? The problem here -- and this is 9 the first time, I am here eleven years, that 10 the tree guard came up, all right? And 11 usually if the County requests something you 12 got to bend a little bit, you know what I 13 mean? You got to bend a little bit. 14 They want the recommendations of 15 the Department of Transportation, they are 16 their tree guards. 17 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: One 18 question. What type of tree is planted in 19 that? 20 MR. DEVINO: It is a plum. 21 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: When it 22 grows up, now it is small, when it grows up 23 what is the growth of the tree? 24 MR. DEVINO: I am sorry? 25 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: The width. 131 1 COMMISSIONER HOLLOWAY: How wide 2 will it go? 3 MR. DEVINO: Not very wide. 4 They are not large trees. Typically about 5 seven and a half to eight feet tall is about 6 how high it would get. 7 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: I live in 8 West New York and we have a lot of trees in 9 West New York. On my block we have trees and 10 if you look at the trees they don't have a 11 guard to protect the trees and they have to be 12 planting trees all the time there. 13 They are spending money on 14 planting the trees. I think the guard for the 15 trees is a great idea. I saw it as a good 16 idea. 17 With regard to speaking about we 18 are talking about Hoboken is moving to -- 19 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: The sixth 20 borough of New York. 21 MR. LEANZA: That's what they do 22 in New York, that's why we did it. 23 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: That would 24 protect the trees. Would it damage a car? 25 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: I 132 1 personally say we never had this problem, I 2 thought, that I know of. 3 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: I think on 4 this case I am not saying that the County is 5 going to do that, but as the Commissioner we 6 are trying to punish them for not filing the 7 application and we have approved applications 8 of other people before the Board. 9 The great things is they have 10 their own parking spaces. 11 COMMISSIONER HOLLOWAY: I 12 disagree with you totally on this. 13 We always went on the 14 recommendation of the NJDOT. 15 If they came in front of us 16 before this building came up I am sure we 17 would say the same thing about the guards. If 18 he had brought the guards in front of us and 19 we would, you would have made a decision to do 20 it or not to do it. This Board would have 21 said yes or no. 22 MR. LEANZA: May I make a 23 suggestion? 24 ATTORNEY CALVANICO: There is a 25 motion on the floor. It has been seconded. 133 1 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: It hasn't 2 been seconded. 3 ATTORNEY CALVANICO: I thought 4 Commissioner Arencibia seconded. 5 MR. LEANZA: May I make a 6 suggestion? If the only hangup is the tree 7 guard, this matter still has the jurisdiction 8 before Judge Giampoli. 9 So if you could approve this 10 subject to the tree guard and I can work out 11 with the attorney who is representing the 12 county legally who is wrong. 13 I know it is Vogelman who did it 14 and she is a registered professional planner, 15 has a lot of experience in this field and so 16 do I, and I think as two professionals we can 17 work out whether or not the county is entitled 18 to require us to change a tree guard and if we 19 determine yes, we will take it down. 20 If not, maybe we will before 21 Judge Giampoli, I don't know. But he still 22 has jurisdiction over the case. 23 So if we could approve it 24 subject to that, and maybe between Ms. 25 Vogelman and I, we could get it straightened 134 1 out. 2 COMMISSIONER CHOFFO: Mr. 3 Chairman, on that note I have a question for 4 our attorney Mr. Calvanico. 5 Does this encroachment with the 6 tree guards affect the county right of way? 7 For instance, my question 8 overall is does the Board of Freeholders still 9 have to vote on this or give approval? 10 ATTORNEY CALVANICO: That would 11 be my position. We have never approved 12 anything within the right of way that we did 13 not refer to the County Board of Freeholders. 14 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: That wasn't 15 a problem, right? 16 MR. LEANZA: One more time? 17 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: The tree 18 guard obstructs the county road. 19 MR. LEANZA: Then so does the 20 tree. 21 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: The tree 22 does not. As a matter of fact, the County 23 will love people planting trees, the problem 24 is you build a structure on there, that is the 25 problem. 135 1 MR. LEANZA: If you build a tree 2 without the tree guard as the gentleman from 3 West New York said, the trees die. 4 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: Then you 5 got to spend more money on planting more 6 trees. 7 COMMISSIONER HOLLOWAY: The 8 issue, as being consistent with Board policy, 9 we always went before the Freeholders. 10 MR. LEANZA: We will go to the 11 Freeholders or my suggestion is maybe the 12 Board should make a recommendation to the 13 Freeholders and the Freeholders should adopt 14 the resolution. 15 You are going to use the ADA 16 ones or these more expensive which we think 17 are better ones? 18 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: You don't 19 have a problem with bringing that in front of 20 the Freeholder Board? 21 MR. LEANZA: No. 22 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: If he 23 uses the tree grades that wouldn't be a 24 Freeholder approval for that, necessarily. 25 The only planter would be the 136 1 first one adjacent to the building that would 2 need Freeholder approval. 3 COMMISSIONER BETTINGER: This 4 might seem like a silly solution off the top 5 of my head, it might be silly, what about 6 striping the street so you have designated 7 spots? 8 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Can't do 9 that. 10 COMMISSIONER BETTINGER: I am 11 saying so it would prevent a car from hitting 12 the railing. 13 MR. DEVINO: Again, it has been 14 designed, the location of these trees has been 15 designed to allow the space between two trees 16 so you can open up car doors. It was not 17 blind flip. 18 COMMISSIONER BETTINGER: Lines 19 to park between them? 20 MR. LEANZA: In effect there is 21 a driveway so nobody can park beyond the 22 driveway and somebody is going to park as 23 close as they can to the driveway and that is 24 the spot where the tree guards are. 25 The closer you are to the 137 1 driveway you can open the door to avoid the 2 problem. 3 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: I got a 4 question to the attorney. 5 Can we force them to change 6 those tree guards? Do we have that authority? 7 ATTORNEY CALVANICO: This Board 8 has the authority to make that a condition of 9 the approval. 10 COMMISSIONER HOLLOWAY: Let's do 11 it. Come on. 12 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Nobody 13 seconded it. We are stuck here with the tree 14 guards. 15 I mean we have a motion, we 16 don't have a second. Right now we don't have 17 a second, right? 18 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: It is going 19 to cost more money to do it, to try to put -- 20 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: What 21 happens if they remove the tree guard and 22 don't put a tree guard there at all? Can I 23 ask that question? They just have a pit 24 there. 25 DIRECTOR MARKS: Mr. Chairman, 138 1 the pit would also present a hazard to anybody 2 in a wheelchair trying to traverse the site. 3 That's why a moundable ADA compliant tree 4 guard or tree grade is recommended. 5 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Wouldn't 6 the tree obstruct somebody that is handicapped 7 accessible, a tree that is there obstruct the 8 car, too? 9 MR. LEANZA: It is a tree. 10 MR. DEVINO: Equally so, Mr. 11 Chairman there are utility polls. I live on 12 Madison Street. 13 Sometimes when I park there is a 14 utility pole on the side of my car. I have to 15 adjust a few things to get out of the car. 16 It is laid out so you don't have 17 to do that. The opening between the trees is 18 right there. 19 I can't emphasize enough this 20 wasn't done with the parking of the automobile 21 -- with parking in mind. 22 It was designed and done 23 specifically so you can exit your car. So 24 that is it. 25 COMMISSIONER CHOFFO: Can I show 139 1 Mr. Leanza the picture we are looking at that 2 Mr. Tridente provided to the Board? 3 It might make your position be a 4 little different. If you see this gentleman 5 here, I don't know if you want to mark this in 6 evidence. 7 MR. LEANZA: I saw that before 8 and the guy is not parked. He is more than 6 9 inches from the curb and if he moved up, 10 somebody -- 11 COMMISSIONER CHOFFO: My 12 question is really aimed toward if you had a 13 passenger in the back seat the person would 14 not be able to get out of the car if he was 15 parked closer to the curb. 16 MR. LEANZA: Instead of parking 17 in the driveway where he should have, he 18 parked in front of the driveway. 19 For some reason the guy pulled 20 in on the side there and he just opened the 21 door and parked between the two tree guards. 22 He should have been up further. And as you 23 can see, the space in front of him is vacant. 24 If he pulled up to that space and parked the 25 car as you are supposed to do within six 140 1 inches of the curb and moved up a little bit, 2 he would be able to open up the door without 3 any problem and the rear door would open up 4 too and the rear door or northern tree guard 5 would be where the trunk where the rear wheel 6 of the tire of the car would have been. 7 COMMISSIONER CHOFFO: Just 8 trying to come up with a solution because we 9 are at a standstill. 10 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: There is 11 another picture with the car in between. 12 MR. DEVINO: There are two 13 parking spaces between the driveway. 14 MR. LEANZA: The space is 44 15 feet and the driveway is 15. 16 MR. DEVINO: Ten, 20, 15 feet, 17 and he goes up to the southern side of the 18 property line. 19 MR. LEANZA: The first car is 20 designed to open up right between the tree 21 guards. 22 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: I think 23 there was another picture with the car parked 24 in between the -- 25 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: Can you 141 1 cut back the tree guard you have there already 2 from the curb another foot or so to give more 3 clearance from the curb? 4 (Whereupon, an off-the-record 5 discussion was held.) 6 MR. LEANZA: Yes. The owner 7 says yes. 8 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: So that 9 would add it. 10 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: All 11 right. 12 MR. LEANZA: The owner said it 13 would be at a cost because he would have to 14 relocate some of the pavers, but he would be 15 willing to do that if that would be a 16 compromise. 17 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: I am 18 not talking about moving the whole thing. 19 MR. LEANZA: For the curb. 20 MR. DEVINO: That would 21 certainly protect the walkers. 22 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: This 23 would still be conditional upon the 24 Freeholder's approval. 25 MR. LEANZA: Okay, fine. 142 1 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: I amend my 2 motion again to have Freeholder approval for 3 the encroachment and to have the -- 4 MR. LEANZA: Planters set one 5 foot from the curb? 6 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: -- set back 7 one foot from the curb. 8 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: From 9 the back of the curb. 10 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Second? 11 COMMISSIONER NG: Second. 12 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: I want to 13 thank Commissioner Holloway who is sitting up 14 here all puzzled. It was a good idea. 15 DIRECTOR MARKS: Mr. Chairman, 16 on a motion to approve application 2008-02-SP 17 made by Commissioner Munoz and seconded by 18 Commissioner Ng, Commissioner Arencibia? 19 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: Aye. 20 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 21 Bettinger? 22 COMMISSIONER BETTINGER: Aye. 23 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 24 Choffo? 25 COMMISSIONER CHOFFO: Based on 143 1 the recommendations, I vote yes. 2 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 3 DiDomenico? 4 COMMISSIONER DIDOMENICO: Aye. 5 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 6 Holloway? 7 COMMISSIONER HOLLOWAY: Aye. 8 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 9 Mehta? 10 COMMISSIONER MEHTA: The way the 11 application came in front of us and the way 12 presented, I don't feel comfortable. 13 I will be absent. 14 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 15 Munoz? 16 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: Aye. 17 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 18 Ng? 19 COMMISSIONER NG: Aye. 20 DIRECTOR MARKS: Chairman 21 Fitzgibbons? 22 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: On the 23 recommendation that you go before the County 24 Freeholders and you do what the engineer says, 25 yes. 144 1 DIRECTOR MARKS: Mr. Chairman, 2 the motion passes. 3 MR. LEANZA: Thank you for your 4 time, patience and consideration. 5 MR. DEVINO: Thank you. 6 DIRECTOR MARKS: Mr. Chairman, 7 the next application scheduled for public 8 hearing is 2007-081-SP, Hoboken Municipal 9 Hospital Authority located at 308 Willow 10 Avenue which is Block 53, Lot 2 in the City of 11 Hoboken. 12 Sorry, I made a mistake. The 13 shipyard. I skipped over. 14 Mr. Chairman, the next 15 application scheduled for public hearing is 16 2007-069-SP, Shipyard Associates, L.P. located 17 at 1404 Hudson Street which is Block 263.3, 18 Lot 1 in the City of Hoboken. 19 MR. KARASICK: Ira Karasick 20 representing Shipyards Associates L.P. 21 Chairman Fitzgibbons, 22 Commissioners, this is an application site 23 plan approval for -- to build -- we have a 24 93-unit residential building as part of the 25 shipyard plan unit development. 145 1 Just brief background, the 2 shipyard plan unit development is 19 land 3 acres, approximately 24 water acres at the 4 northern end of Hoboken. 5 It was approved, there was a 6 planned unit development by the Hoboken 7 Planning Board in January of 1997 and 8 subsequently it was approved by the Planning 9 Board I believe in March of 1997. 10 Since that time the project has 11 been built out according to the original 12 plans. 13 This building, however, required 14 an amended preliminary site plan because it 15 had originally been scheduled for 60 units and 16 we asked for 93 and it was so approved by the 17 Hoboken Planning Board. 18 It lies on two county roads at 19 the corner of Hudson Street and Fourteenth 20 Street, so that is the reason we are in front 21 of the county jurisdiction and I have with me 22 Mr. Eric Ballou. He is an engineer. He is 23 the engineer for the projects. He can give 24 engineering testimony. 25 We had -- we received a set of 146 1 comments from T&M Associates from the 2 engineers and addressed those comments and we 3 received the revised sheet, revised April 1st 4 indicating that all of the engineer's comments 5 were addressed except one continuing comment. 6 We had to provide copies of all 7 permits and municipal approvals. We are 8 waiting for the Planning Board resolution. 9 The Planning Board approved this 10 project in February, but the March meeting 11 didn't have a quorum so they couldn't approve 12 any resolutions. 13 The other thing that I noticed 14 in the recommendations I believe from Mr. 15 Marks were they asked us to include a ten 16 space bicycle rack on the plans. 17 I don't believe they are on the 18 current plans in front of you and we accept 19 that recommendation and Mr. Ballou is going to 20 figure out the appropriate place to put it, 21 but we will put a ten space bicycle rack 22 there. 23 Other than that, I don't know if 24 the Board has -- if you would like me to give 25 you more detail or if you would like Mr. 147 1 Ballou to describe the project he has 2 regarding elevation, showing what the 3 buildings looks like from the county roads, he 4 can address that. 5 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Can you 6 be sworn in. 7 ATTORNEY CALVANICO: Spell your 8 last name spell it. 9 MR. BALLOU: Eric Ballou, 10 B-A-L-L-O-U. 11 (Eric Ballou was duly sworn.) 12 MR. KARASICK: Could you briefly 13 give the Board your engineering experience. 14 MR. BALLOU: Professional 15 engineer in the State of New Jersey practicing 16 for eleven years. 17 I have done a lot of work in 18 Jersey City with regards to the Port Liberty 19 Development, Liberty National Golf Course. 20 I am also the site engineer for 21 the W Host Team Project in Hoboken as well as 22 the this building and the shipyard area. 23 MR. KARASICK: We ask Mr. Ballou 24 be qualified as an engineer. 25 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: He is 148 1 well qualified. 2 MR. KARASICK: Thank you. 3 Mr. Ballou, you prepared the 4 engineering plan and the site plan for this 5 project? 6 MR. BALLOU: Correct. 7 MR. KARASICK: Why don't you 8 describe to the Commissioners basically how 9 the project impacts on the county road, I 10 guess would be the first issue, and have you 11 answer any questions. 12 MR. BALLOU: Okay, great. 13 I am going to turn around and 14 look at exhibit -- 15 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Can we 16 mark that? 17 MR. BALLOU: Yes. Do you want 18 to mark it as A-1? 19 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Yes. 20 (Exhibit so marked.) 21 MR. BALLOU: And this is sheet 22 C-3 that is in the site plan set. 23 MR. CALVANICO: Why don't you 24 mark the other one, as well. 25 MR. BALLOU: This is the 149 1 rendered elevations. I am going to mark that 2 as A-2. 3 (So marked.) 4 MR. BALLOU: Our site fronts 5 upon Hudson Street which is already fully 6 completed and also affronts on Fourteenth 7 Street which also is a completed roadway. 8 The other roadway that affronts 9 upon is the local street, Shipyard Lane. 10 This project is not proposing 11 any roadway improvements, the roadway 12 infrastructure is already in place. 13 What we are doing is taking the 14 existing half acre parcel and placing it 15 instead of a temporary parking lot that is 16 there today we are going to place a 13-story 17 residential building containing 93 units with 18 an associated four-story structured parking 19 garage, so it is basically turned into an 20 in-fill project. 21 This is the last residential 22 building for the shipyard PUD according to the 23 master plan. 24 In regards to drainage, this 25 whole site has already been planned to drain 150 1 out Fourteenth Street and drain into the 2 Hudson River. So we are not changing any of 3 those drainage plans, we are sticking with the 4 original approval. 5 With regards to traffic for this 6 project, we have increased the project by 33 7 units over what was previously approved in the 8 PUD. 9 To address that from a traffic 10 standpoint, Joe Steiger submitted a traffic 11 memorandum addressing how many additional 12 trips we anticipated for this project for 30 13 units. 14 His memo concluded that the peak 15 time would be approximately four trips to the 16 site, would be the overall exposure of adding 17 the additional units. 18 Four trips on a project that is 19 1193 units is very small, so there is no 20 substantial traffic impact of this unit at 21 all. 22 In regards to what the building 23 will look like, I am looking at additional -- 24 two rendered site plans by the architect. 25 The first one is called the east 151 1 elevation. That's what the project would look 2 like from Hudson Street. 3 You will see the 13 story tower 4 adjacent to that which you can't tell because 5 it is covered by the building facility is 6 actually a four-story parking garage. 7 When you drive on Fourteenth 8 Street you will see what is on the right-hand 9 side of the street which is the north 10 elevation, so the building will appear like 11 this (indicating). 12 The three stories match very 13 well with the adjacent buildings. 14 Even though we went up two 15 stories, it still matches up with the overall 16 development. 17 MR. KARASICK: Even though you 18 went up the zoning of 125 feet? 19 MR. BALLOU: We are compliant 20 with zoning, and this project didn't require 21 any waivers or variances or anything because 22 of the additional stories. 23 MR. KARASICK: With respect to 24 the facade along Hudson Street, the Hoboken 25 Planning Board did request that the openings 152 1 into the garage be dressed up a bit. 2 Could you just describe that for 3 us, please. 4 MR. BALLOU: Yes. I am an 5 engineer, not the architect, but what I 6 originally proposed was just grill work within 7 the openings of the garage, but the Hoboken 8 planners required us to put glazing within 9 those openings which was agreed to at the 10 Planning Board. 11 MR. KARASICK: That's correct. 12 Just to make the project more practical. 13 MR. BALLOU: You wouldn't know 14 it is a garage, you would think it is a 15 continuation of the building which is a great 16 appearance in this area. 17 One thing I want to add, we are 18 proposing tree grades that are flush and ADA 19 compliant to be consistent with the 20 surrounding communities, such as we heard 21 throughout the evening. 22 MR. KARASICK: You are planting 23 trees? 24 MR. BALLOU: We are definitely 25 planting trees according to the PUD's 153 1 landscape design. 2 Since we didn't change the 3 roadways. We are sticking with the original 4 approved design for this project. 5 MR. KARASICK: I really don't 6 have anything else, unless the Board has 7 questions. 8 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: Maybe 9 we should have our consultant. 10 MR. KLEIN: Good evening, Mr. 11 Chairman, Lee Klein with T&M Associates. 12 I did review this application. 13 Also met with Mr. Ballou on one occasion when 14 he came into our site plan and subdivision 15 review committee meeting. 16 He has addressed all the 17 comments that I had in my letter. I am 18 satisfied with the outcome of the drainage and 19 the traffic. 20 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: I got a 21 question. The roads were pre-existent which 22 you -- I think didn't the county did those 23 roads before they built there. 24 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: Well, 25 we did the extension of Fourteenth Street and 154 1 15th Street, new roads, and the developer 2 built the road from Hudson Street continuing 3 into -- 4 MR. BALLOU: The Shipyard Lane. 5 That was completed based upon 6 the existing building, the Sovereign building. 7 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: I 8 remember that. 9 Do we have any questions? 10 COMMISSIONER MEHTA: Mr. 11 Chairman, are you going to plan any bicycle 12 rack? 13 MR. BALLOU: We were requested 14 to place a ten stall bicycle rack per your 15 planner's comments. We are going to satisfy 16 that condition when we resubmit for 17 signatures. We will add all that as 18 requested, signature blocks. 19 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Are there 20 any commercial units there? 21 MR. BALLOU: Yes, approximately 22 2000 square feet of retail on Fourteenth 23 Street only and there was already planned on 24 Shipyard Lane, there is already a loading area 25 designated to service those two retail 155 1 tenants. 2 COMMISSIONER DIDOMENICO: I 3 would like to make a motion for approval. 4 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Is there 5 a second? 6 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: Mr. 7 Chairman? 8 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: 9 Commissioner Munoz. 10 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: On 11 Fourteenth Street there are no trees planted. 12 MR. BALLOU: Yes, one, two, 13 three, four street trees along that frontage 14 is proposed. 15 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: Here on the 16 letter we got, it says none on Hudson Street, 17 none 14, on Shipyard Lane. 18 MR. BALLOU: This would be 19 Shipyard Lane, upper roadway area, two, three, 20 four, five, six, seven. Seven trees proposed 21 along that building's frontage as well. 22 MR. TRIDENTE: That report 23 represents present conditions. 24 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: Okay. 25 MR. BALLOU: That makes logical 156 1 sense. 2 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: I want to 3 second. 4 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: We have a 5 motion and a second. 6 DIRECTOR MARKS: Mr. Chairman, 7 there is a motion made by Commissioner 8 DiDomenico and seconded by Commissioner Munoz 9 to approve application 2007-069-SP. 10 On the motion, Commissioner 11 Arencibia? 12 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: Aye. 13 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 14 Bettinger? 15 COMMISSIONER BETTINGER: Aye. 16 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 17 Choffo? 18 COMMISSIONER CHOFFO: Aye. 19 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 20 DiDomenico? 21 COMMISSIONER DIDOMENICO: Aye. 22 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 23 Holloway? 24 COMMISSIONER HOLLOWAY: Aye. 25 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 157 1 Mehta? 2 COMMISSIONER MEHTA: Aye. 3 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 4 Munoz? 5 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: Aye. 6 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 7 Ng? 8 COMMISSIONER NG: Aye. 9 DIRECTOR MARKS: And Chairman 10 Fitzgibbons. 11 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Yes. 12 DIRECTOR MARKS: Mr. Chairman, 13 the motion passed. 14 MR. BALLOU: Do you keep the 15 exhibits? 16 DIRECTOR MARKS: Yes. 17 Mr. Chairman, the next 18 application scheduled for public hearing is 19 2007-069-SP, Shipyard Associates, LP, located 20 at -- that is the one we just did. 21 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: It is a 22 long night. 23 DIRECTOR MARKS: The next 24 application is 2007-081-SP, Hoboken Municipal 25 Hospital Authority located at 308 Willow 158 1 Avenue which is Block 53, Lot 2 in the City of 2 Hoboken. 3 MR. MATULEA: Good evening. 4 Robert Matulea, M-A-T-U-L-E-A, appearing on 5 behalf of the applicants. 6 This is the application with 7 respect to the proposed new emergency room on 8 the corner are of Fourth and Willow at Hoboken 9 University Medical Center. 10 We have already received our 11 approvals from the City of Hoboken. We have 12 several witnesses to present tonight because 13 of some of the questions that have been 14 raised. 15 I have Colon Beers here from 16 Gary Associates who are the architects. 17 We have Steven Musanic from 18 McNeil Engineering to address some of the 19 engineering questions. 20 And I have Mr. Spiro Siltaris, 21 the vice president of the hospital to address 22 some of the operational issues. 23 So if we could, I would like to 24 call Colon Beers and have him just give you an 25 overview of the proposed structure and we can 159 1 get into some of the engineering questions if 2 we have to. 3 MR. MATULEA: Could we have Mr. 4 Beers sworn. 5 ATTORNEY CALVANICO: State your 6 name, spell your last name for the record. 7 MR. BEERS: Colon Beers, 8 B-E-E-R-S. 9 (Colon Beers was duly sworn.) 10 MR. MATULEA: Mr. Beers, do you 11 have an exhibit -- do you want to start with 12 the facade? Maybe start with the facade. 13 Mark this A-1. 14 (So marked.) 15 MR. MATULEA: Just for the 16 record, I am marking it A-1. 17 Would you describe the exhibit 18 and explain it to the Board members. 19 MR. BEERS: What you are looking 20 at is the proposed single story addition on 21 the corner of Willow which runs along the 22 bottom of the drawing, and Fourth Street which 23 runs along the side here. 24 This is a view as if seen from 25 across the street which is a park. 160 1 Immediately to the right here is 2 a church and there is a residence along the 3 street on the other side of the street. 4 It is a single story building, 5 it is designed out of brick to match the 6 hospital. Identical in dimension and color. 7 It has a glass and clear 8 aluminum window draping for the lobby which is 9 an extra high space on a single story wall but 10 it is a little higher than a normal ceiling 11 height. 12 The canopy is shown, the one on 13 the Willow Street side which is the walk-in 14 entrance for people who are able to get to the 15 hospital on their own, and the Fourth Street 16 entrance shows the canopy and the location of 17 the ambulance drop-off area which would be for 18 acute arrivals by ambulance. 19 So we have those two entrance 20 points separated for clarity of arrival on the 21 site and then really no other building 22 materials involved. 23 There is a cobblestone sill at 24 the window and metal coping and various areas 25 of metal panels on the canopies themselves and 161 1 some of the upper parts of the building that 2 are above pedestrians level. 3 MR. MATULEA: How about exterior 4 lighting on both facades? 5 MR. BEERS: Exterior lighting is 6 fairly minimal in the canopies themselves. 7 There are candle lights that 8 produce about three foot candles at grade to 9 light the surfaces and make a safe entrance at 10 the transitions from the street areas. 11 The lobby itself will be lit 12 inside as with ceiling only pendant-like 13 fixtures glowing at night and visible during 14 the evening at normal waiting room levels, 15 nothing excessive. 16 The windows themselves of course 17 lit at night from the inside and at the corner 18 of the building in a spot I can show you on 19 the site plan, one small round light mounted 20 at a high point. 21 It is a dome light just to 22 provide some general lighting in an area that 23 is a corner. We want to have a little bit of 24 light there. 25 And as you move down the street 162 1 to the left on the drawing you are actually 2 heading towards the main entrance to the 3 hospital so the walk-in entrance and the main 4 entrance to the facility are located along 5 Willow. 6 MR. MATULEA: Do you want to go 7 over the supplemental? 8 MR. BEERS: We will show you the 9 site plan briefly. We will label this A-2. 10 (So marked.) 11 MR. BEERS: For architectural 12 purposes only we will have separate drawings 13 that talk about the site, the curbing and the 14 sidewalking. 15 So, but for the inside layout, 16 everything shaded in gray is the existing 17 hospital. 18 The radiology department and the 19 main front entrance are the areas immediately 20 adjacent here. 21 This is currently an open lot 22 and this is a one-story building planned to 23 abut the existing building on every surface 24 and then become the new street edge on Willow 25 and the new street for part of the block with 163 1 the existing hospital continuing on Fourth. 2 You can see the general layout 3 is a loop. Patient treatment areas around the 4 perimeter. A core of support egresses for 5 ease of access by physicians and nurses, the 6 ambulance coming straight into a security desk 7 and two resuscitation desks which are for 8 cardiac or other acute needs and then the 9 walk-in entrance presents itself to a 10 reception and triage area where an assessment 11 is made if you are stable or not and a 12 perimeter loop corridor getting to all private 13 areas. 14 So this will be all patient 15 rooms for the treatment spaces themselves. 16 The light I mentioned earlier is 17 at this corner, one on each side, at this far 18 corner, the plan closest to the main entrance 19 and it is at the remote spot from the walk-in 20 entrance about halfway between the door from 21 the walk-in and the main entrance to the 22 hospital. 23 MR. MATULEA: Thank you. 24 I don't know if you want to hold 25 your questions until I have each person 164 1 testify or if you want to ask each person 2 specific questions now. 3 I will have Mr. Busanic testify 4 next. I think he can talk to some of the 5 engineering aspects and the pull-offs and 6 things of that nature. 7 So I will defer to the Board how 8 they want to do that procedurally. 9 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Does 10 anybody have questions here? Any questions? 11 COMMISSIONER HOLLOWAY: Which 12 block is the county road? 13 COMMISSIONER MEHTA: Willow? 14 MR. KARASICK: From Fourth to 15 Third. 16 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: On the 17 corner of Fourth and Willow. 18 COMMISSIONER HOLLOWAY: If I 19 could see the first picture you showed. 20 MR. BEERS: Yes, sir. 21 COMMISSIONER HOLLOWAY: Which 22 street is that? 23 MR. BEERS: This is Fourth. 24 COMMISSIONER HOLLOWAY: And 25 Willow. 165 1 MR. BEERS: Willow. 2 COMMISSIONER HOLLOWAY: Is that 3 encroachment to our county right of way here 4 where the car is? It looks like. 5 MR. BEERS: This is a new 6 pull-off area moving toward the site line and 7 again the civil engineers are here to talk 8 about dimensions. 9 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: The 10 emergency vehicles will put in on Fourth 11 Street? 12 MR. BEERS: No backing up, no 13 K-turn. Two normal. 14 Any questions I defer to civil, 15 but it is designed for two vehicles side by 16 side out of the normal pathway of cars and 17 parking on the street and it is designed not 18 to require any backing up by the squad on 19 arrival so they can leave. 20 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: My 21 question is how many parking spots will the 22 county lose? 23 MR. BEERS: The civil engineer 24 is prepared to answer that question. 25 COMMISSIONER MEHTA: The 166 1 hospital had an existing emergency room? 2 MR. BEERS: Yes, it does. 3 COMMISSIONER MEHTA: Are you 4 going to modify that one or this will be, 5 there is another? 6 MR. MATULEA: If I may, Mr. 7 Mehta, we are going to have the operations 8 director from the hospital speak to that, what 9 is going to happen to the existing emergency 10 room and how that space is going to be 11 reutilized. 12 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: Can I see 13 the second one? 14 MR. BEERS: Yes, sir. A-2 is 15 the floor plan 16 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: Are those 17 trees in there? 18 MR. BEERS: Yes. This is 19 illustrative. This was done in early February 20 a year ago. The newer ones are going to 21 address tree quantity and count. 22 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: Are you 23 planning to pull out the tree on the corner 24 right there or it is going to be empty like 25 that? 167 1 MR. BEERS: This was an early 2 artist's rendering. I defer to the civil 3 engineering drawing to talk about the exact 4 placement. 5 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Do we 6 have a traffic study on that too? 7 MR. BEERS: We had previously 8 submitted a traffic study that was done for 9 the new garage that was built on the Clinton 10 Street side of the hospital and again Mr. 11 Hatiras is going to speak to what is there 12 right now. 13 What was there was a surface 14 parking lot and those vehicles have all been 15 moved over into the parking garage, the 16 hospital parking garage, but Mr. Hatiras will 17 speak to that. 18 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Okay. 19 Let's hear from him. 20 MR. MATULEA: If I may, if you 21 don't have any questions with respect to the 22 architectural, I would like to bring Mr. 23 Busanic up and have him talk to some of the 24 more civil engineering questions and go over 25 that and then address those questions and then 168 1 Mr. Hatiras. 2 Steve, come on up. 3 ATTORNEY CALVANICO: State your 4 name spell your last name. 5 MR. BUSANIC: Steven Busanic, 6 B-U-S-A-N-I-C. 7 (Steven Busanic was duly sworn.) 8 MR. MATULEA: Mr. Busanic, you 9 are with MacDill? 10 MR. BUSANIC: Yes, a licensed 11 professional engineer in the State of New 12 Jersey since 2001. 13 I am a project manager 14 practicing civil engineering at MacDill 15 Engineering. 16 MR. MATULEA: And you are 17 working on this project, right? 18 MR. BUSANIC: Design and 19 oversight on this project. 20 MR. MATULEA: We have an exhibit 21 there, can we mark that A-3. 22 (So marked.) 23 MR. MATULEA: Would you just go 24 through it. 25 MR. BUSANIC: This is a colored 169 1 version of the site plan, dimensional plan. 2 The dark brown represents the 3 proposed building, the light brown represents 4 proposed new sidewalk, and the dark gray 5 represents new proposed pavement. 6 The existing site is an existing 7 paved parking lot, 100 percent paved. There 8 are two curb cuts for the existing parking 9 lot, one along Willow Avenue and one along 10 Fourth Street. 11 Those curb cuts will be removed 12 and the net loss on Willow Avenue is one 13 parking space loss. 14 We can create a new space by 15 rebuilding the curb where the existing curb 16 cut is for the existing parking lot. 17 The site plan was developed so 18 that we have two separate entrances, one for 19 ambulance entry and one for regular vehicle 20 drop-offs. 21 The regular vehicle drop-off 22 emergency entrance would be along Willow 23 Avenue and we have designed it where there is 24 a pull-in area so it wouldn't obstruct traffic 25 along Willow Avenue. 170 1 MR. MATULEA: And the pull-off 2 on Fourth Street that is for ambulances, is 3 that partially in the street and partially on 4 the hospital property? 5 MR. BUSANIC: Correct. The 6 Fourth Street ambulance entry has room for two 7 ambulance width and can accommodate 8 approximately four to five ambulances at a 9 time. 10 MR. MATULEA: And that was also 11 designed so it wouldn't impact with the main 12 car traffic on Fourth Street? 13 MR. BUSANIC: Correct. 14 MR. MATULEA: And on the Willow 15 Ave. side, are you doing planting along that 16 side? 17 MR. BUSANIC: Yes. We have 18 proposed new landscaping along Willow Avenue 19 along the building, a six foot landscape strip 20 with some shrubs, and we also have four 21 existing street trees to remain along with two 22 proposed street trees along Willow Avenue. 23 MR. MATULEA: And is the 24 planting strip on the hospital property or on 25 the sidewalk right of way? 171 1 MR. BUSANIC: The planting strip 2 is five feet within the property and about one 3 foot outside of the property. 4 MR. MATULEA: And to the extent 5 it encroaches onto the county property, if we 6 have to apply for an easement from the Board 7 of Freeholders, the applicant will do that? 8 MR. BUSANIC: Yes. There is no 9 proposed curb or low wall or fence for that 10 planter island. 11 MR. MATULEA: And you have 12 various correspondence from T&M Associates? 13 MR. BUSANIC: I have. 14 MR. MATULEA: With respect to 15 detectible warning curb ramps, limits of 16 pavement restoration, et cetera. 17 The plans have all been amended 18 to reflect that? 19 MR. BUSANIC: Yes. 20 MR. MATULEA: And those plans 21 were submitted this evening to Mr. Marks? 22 MR. BUSANIC: This evening. 23 MR. MATULEA: One of the things 24 that was raised in the letters back and forth 25 was addressing how the storm water will be 172 1 conveyed from the site. 2 Could you talk about how that is 3 currently done and how it will be done in the 4 proposed structure. 5 MR. BUSANIC: Yes. As I said, 6 the existing site is 100 percent paved. By 7 adding some landscaping on the Willow Avenue 8 side, reducing the storm water runoff impact 9 to the sewer system, the proposed sanitary and 10 storm sewers connect to a combined sewer in 11 Willow Avenue and that combined sewer is owned 12 and operated by the North Hudson Sewerage 13 Authority. 14 MR. MATULEA: So net impact -- 15 MR. BUSANIC: No impact on the 16 storm sewer runoff, reducing actually the peak 17 runoff rate. 18 MR. MATULEA: Fine. 19 I have no further questions of 20 Mr. Busanic. 21 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: What 22 existed before the parking lot there? 23 MR. BUSANIC: Before the parking 24 lot? I think the representative of the 25 hospital could best answer that. 173 1 MR. MATULEA: My understanding 2 is there was an emergency room. 3 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: No, it 4 was a school for nursing. 5 MR. MATULEA: Well, we will have 6 Mr. Hatiras speak to that: 7 MR. HATIRAS: Spiros Hatiras, 8 H-A-T-I-R-A-S. 9 (Spiros Hatiras was duly sworn.) 10 MR. HATIRAS: The question is? 11 MR. MATULEA: First of all 12 identify what your position is with the 13 hospital. 14 MR. HATIRAS: Vice president of 15 administration with Hope University Medical 16 Center. 17 Been there 17 years. Not long 18 enough to have seen those buildings, but I can 19 tell you what I know about them. 20 You are correct, at some point 21 or another there was a school of nursing but 22 also an emergency room. 23 As a matter of fact, several 24 buildings since the 1800s went up and down on 25 that side. 174 1 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: 2 Four-story brick structures. It was a 3 four-story brick structure. 4 MR. HATIRAS: Yes. 5 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: My 6 question is, as you see on that next block you 7 got a park, you have a church, and you have 8 the school. 9 MR. HATIRAS: Correct. 10 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: You are 11 going to have -- my question is about the 12 emergency room being changed from going down 13 Second and coming up Third shooting off where 14 the park and the school goes and turning into 15 Fourth Street. 16 Now, there is a light there but 17 I don't -- what kind of light is there? 18 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: I don't 19 know if there is a traffic light. 20 MR. MATULEA: Blinker. 21 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: My 22 concern is during recess or when school gets 23 out with emergencies flying through there, I 24 am afraid that with that kind of emergency 25 route G-d forbid something happens to those 175 1 kids. 2 MR. HATIRAS: If I could address 3 that. The current route that the ambulance 4 takes, because I believe you live in Hoboken 5 in the neighborhood, is down Willow Avenue. 6 So that is the current route. That doesn't 7 change. 8 Primarily they do come down 9 Willow Avenue. Now what happens currently as 10 you said correctly, sometimes they will 11 continue down to Second Street and go around 12 the block. 13 Other times and it happens every 14 day, they turn on Fourth, cross again, go down 15 I believe Adams Street the next one, if I am 16 not mistaken, and go down on Third. 17 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Grand? 18 MR. HATIRAS: I apologize, to 19 Grand. To go down Grand and come around 20 Third. 21 It is a choice of the ambulance 22 drivers. There is no consistency. 23 So what we are actually seeing 24 is we are going to reduce a lot of that 25 circling the block situation we have now and 176 1 make it safer because our traffic and our 2 emergency room visits are primarily from the 3 north and so the ambulance coming down Willow 4 will have a very short turn on Fourth and be 5 right there instead of circling blocks on 6 Second or Fourth Street. 7 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Was this 8 brought up before the Hoboken Planning Board? 9 MR. HATIRAS: Yes, it was, and 10 we addressed it as I explained it here as 11 well. They were satisfied. 12 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: I am 13 worried about the park, two schools and one 14 school. 15 MR. MATULEA: I can represent to 16 you, Mr. Fitzgibbons, that this was discussed 17 at great detail before the Planning Board. 18 Consultation with Eileen Binera 19 the Planning Board Planner went into exactly 20 how the pull-off was planned on Fourth Street. 21 After a great deal of discussion 22 the City was satisfied with the planning. I 23 believe we attached the resolution to the 24 application of approval and just anecdotally 25 for whatever it is worth at the hearing 177 1 because there was some questions by neighbors 2 about traffic going east and west on Fourth 3 Street and pretty much the Planning Board was 4 satisfied that with this new design people are 5 going to walk on the north side of the street 6 rather than the south side of the street and 7 there is a blinker light at that intersection 8 at Fourth and Willow. 9 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: Mr. 10 Chairman? 11 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: 12 Commissioner Munoz. 13 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: One 14 question. 15 This drainage here, is that 16 going to stay there? 17 MR. BUSANIC: Yes, the inlets 18 are to remain. 19 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: Would you 20 consider -- bring the other picture up. 21 (Complying.) 22 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: Is there 23 enough space to plant a tree on the corner? 24 Would that be a recommendation? 25 MR. BUSANIC: Yes. That was a 178 1 recommendation by the town planner and we 2 worked in conjunction with her to propose two 3 street trees offset from that corner. 4 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Would 5 that make it a blind spot? 6 DIRECTOR MARKS: That is my 7 concern, Mr. Chairman. I think the site plan 8 issues are with vehicular traffic. 9 MR. BUSANIC: I would tend to 10 disagree because the traffic is, if you look 11 at the site plan, the traffic on Fourth Street 12 is traveling westbound. 13 The street trees are 14 proportioned on the southeast corner so the 15 line of site for two vehicles stopped at that 16 intersection -- 17 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: We are 18 talking about pedestrians, aren't we? 19 DIRECTOR MARKS: Vehicular 20 traffic. That is not an issue. 21 MR. BUSANIC: -- would be 22 looking in the opposite direction of the 23 trees. 24 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: One is a 25 red blanking light and the other one coming 179 1 down is amber? 2 MR. BUSANIC: Correct. 3 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: That is 4 where the drainage is going to be at, right? 5 MR. BUSANIC: Yes. 6 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: A matter 7 of fact, you buried some air conditioners -- I 8 go to cardiac rehab, you buried the air 9 conditioners over there. 10 Do you have anything, T&M? 11 MR. MATULEA: I am still going 12 to have Mr. Hatiras give testimony. 13 MR. HATIRAS: Actually there 14 were a number of questions in the letters we 15 received. 16 If you prefer I will answer any 17 questions. I can go on a narrative. 18 MR. MATULEA: Let me ask a 19 couple of questions, because this was one of 20 the issues raised in the correspondence back 21 and forth. 22 Could you just briefly describe 23 the relocation of the service park and how 24 many cars were there and what's happened to 25 them and what the ramifications have been 180 1 sense then. 2 MR. HATIRAS: We did close the 3 parking lot in preparation on December 1st of 4 2007 and we have accommodated all the 5 employees' cars, physician cars, visitors in 6 the garage, in the back located on Clinton and 7 Fourth and we have had no issues. Parking has 8 not been an issue for us. 9 MR. MATULEA: And then a 10 question was raised about the plans for the 11 reuse of the existing emergency room on Third 12 and Clinton. 13 MR. HATIRAS: The hospital as it 14 is now -- and we have a tremendous space 15 crunch because a lot of the services were at 16 St. Frances Hospital in Jersey City and when 17 that was closed they moved over, so actually 18 that space is just going to be used to give 19 folks some breathing room and give them a 20 little more space for their programs. 21 MR. MATULEA: No intention of 22 adding additional departments or anything? 23 MR. HATIRAS: No. 24 MR. MATULEA: With the 25 relocation of the emergency room, are you 181 1 anticipating any significant increase in the 2 number of staff people or traffic generated by 3 the relocation to the emergency room? 4 MR. HATIRAS: No. Actually when 5 you look at the plans, the new emergency room 6 is going to be approximately twice the size as 7 the old, but the number of visits to emergency 8 are basically a function of the demographics 9 and how sick people get, not a function of the 10 size of the emergency room. 11 What we are doing is we have an 12 emergency that sees about 32,000 a year 13 designed for 10,000. 14 What we are doing now is we are 15 bringing it up to current standards and best 16 practices and giving people the privacy they 17 need and the kind of services they need. 18 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Do you 19 think there will be an increase due to the 20 closing? 21 MR. HATIRAS: That is an 22 interesting question. 23 I don't think all the way from 24 Greenville, but as you know, what happens in 25 health care in New Jersey is anybody's guess 182 1 in terms of who is closing and who stays open. 2 We have no reason to believe 3 that we are suddenly going to have more 4 emergency visits in Hoboken. 5 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: The old 6 emergency is going to be used for a 7 differential space. 8 You have a ship and receiving 9 dock over there, don't you? 10 MR. HATIRAS: That will remain 11 where it is. One of the reasons why we need 12 to move is, other than being small, it is not 13 a desirable way to introduce patients to your 14 hospital, being right next to the loading 15 dock. 16 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: You walk 17 in that emergency room you are going to have 18 to breath the diesel fuel. 19 MR. HATIRAS: I have been there 20 seventeen years and I am proud to say we are 21 finally getting to where Hoboken needs to be. 22 They need a nice new emergency room. 23 MR. MATULEA: Mr. Hatiras, could 24 you just briefly speak to the process for not 25 the ambulance side but the Willow side when 183 1 cars will pull into that pull-off to discharge 2 somebody to the walk-up entrance of the 3 emergency room. 4 MR. HATIRAS: There were some 5 concerns raised by the other board which we 6 subsequently addressed such as the pullover 7 where people are willing to leave their car 8 there and what they do currently is walk to 9 the main entrance which is a little further 10 down on Willow. 11 We have a security guard station 12 during the entire day and they make sure that 13 traffic moves and they don't block patient 14 drop-off and the same thing, the center will 15 have a concierge-type security to make sure 16 people will park legally. 17 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: The 18 Hoboken Parking Authority will make sure you 19 park legal around the hospital or you get a 20 ticket. 21 MR. HATIRAS: Yes, you do get a 22 boot, I think. 23 MR. MATULEA: Nothing further 24 unless the Board has specific questions. 25 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: T&M? 184 1 MR. KLEIN: Can you tell us a 2 little bit about the width of the sidewalk 3 along Willow Avenue? 4 I see where there wasn't this 5 little drop-off area. Can we talk about the 6 width there? 7 MR. BUSANIC: The existing 8 sidewalk is, the existing sidewalk along 9 Willow Avenue is 18 feet and that will remain 10 along the majority of the building. 11 At the emergency drop-off it is 12 reduced down to 14 feet. Sorry, 12 feet, 13 sorry. 14 MR. KLEIN: So it is just a six 15 foot drop-off width? 16 MR. BUSANIC: Yes. 17 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: How 18 long is the drop-off? 19 MR. BUSANIC: There is a two 20 foot drop-off between the property. 21 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: For one 22 car? 23 MR. BUSANIC: Yes, one car. 24 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: There 25 is already another drop-off on Willow Avenue. 185 1 MR. BUSANIC: That is for the 2 main entrance, not for the emergency 3 department. 4 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: Nothing 5 is going to change there, it will stay the way 6 it is? 7 MR. HATIRAS: No changes. 8 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: The 9 pedestrians on Willow Avenue going to the 10 hospital, do they continue or they cross at 11 the pull-off, at the existing pull-off, right? 12 MR. KLEIN: They follow the line 13 of Willow Avenue. 14 MR. BUSANIC: Yes. 15 MR. KLEIN: They turn out twice, 16 the main entrance turnout existing now or they 17 have to cross once? 18 MR. BUSANIC: Cross once. 19 MR. HATIRAS: If I may address 20 it, they do not cross. The median is too 21 small. They just follow the sidewalk around. 22 MR. KLEIN: Close to the 23 building? Okay. 24 COMMISSIONER MEHTA: Can you put 25 that second sign up? 186 1 Other than the ambulance canopy, 2 do you propose any signage? 3 MR. BEERS: At the time this was 4 an illustration what our intention was for 5 walk-in and the ambulance. 6 The signage package would be 7 something that would have its own approval 8 process, I believe, so that the sign, the way 9 the letters are lit, that is something that 10 needs to be run through the appropriate 11 agency. 12 There is no other signage we 13 propose as far as the one-story addition. 14 COMMISSIONER MEHTA: You 15 mentioned it will be well lighted, the 16 outside. Willow or Fourth Street? 17 MR. BEERS: What I mentioned was 18 in this canopy there are only four lights. 19 Three are recessed. They shine only down and 20 they provide -- they light the surface, not 21 the building itself so they are designed to 22 light the area where you would want to be sure 23 of your footing. 24 And the same thing on the 25 ambulance side, it is with more frequency. I 187 1 could tell you the same number. It is a 2 longer canopy. 3 Same identical fixture, just 4 generally lighting the grade level, not to 5 create an area to do any work outside the 6 building. 7 They want to get the patient in 8 the building as soon as possible. 9 COMMISSIONER MEHTA: My only 10 concern is across the street there is a 11 neighborhood and if you or any of your signage 12 or lighting is going to be disturbing them or 13 it will be recessed curb area. 14 MR. BEERS: We had been asked 15 that question at the earlier meeting. Across 16 the street on Fourth Street is the church. 17 Across the street on the Willow 18 Avenue side are some residences, doctors, 19 offices, funeral home, a number of things 20 along the street there. 21 These lights, as I said, are 22 recessed so they don't protrude from the 23 canopy at all. There is no edge to be 24 visible. 25 They are designed to shine 188 1 straight down, not with a wide spread and the 2 amount of foot candles at grade is a three 3 foot candle, not bright at all, designed to 4 light the surface and designed to make a safe 5 transition from the tactical services and the 6 walk-off mats and the entrance itself. 7 So we had been asked and we 8 provided some information about the wattage 9 and the foot candle and thought we had a 10 balance between lighting the area well without 11 providing an all night glow that was overly 12 bright, more than you would find with the 13 streetlighting or general lighting along the 14 pedestrian way. 15 I appreciate the question. 16 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: How the 17 corner going to be lit? 18 MR. BEERS: This corner? 19 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: Yes. 20 MR. BEERS: As I said, this area 21 is actually a high waiting space. It is one 22 story high, but the ceiling height in that 23 area is in excess of 12 feet so it is a 24 smaller space to make a waiting area seem more 25 comfortable while you are waiting. 189 1 That area has lighting 2 internally on the ceiling. It also has three 3 lights in the front pendant, decorative, to be 4 attractive in the street and create that 5 hospitality imagery. 6 The lighting that is designed 7 for the lobby is just standard recessed 8 lighting in the ceiling and again it is 9 something -- right now it is designed -- it is 10 on or off. 11 We did look into it and it is 12 something if we wanted to put that in with a 13 dimmer switch, for example, so there was 14 control of the light level at different times 15 during the day, that that is something that is 16 possible with the fixtures we mentioned 17 already. 18 It is meant to be lit but not 19 blasting. Of course there will be some light 20 onto the curb and onto the street. 21 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Are there 22 going to be any street openings to put 23 electrical services into that, that area? 24 MR. BUSANIC: No. The electric 25 service is coming from the existing building. 190 1 MR. HATIRAS: There will be 2 openings for connections to the sewer. I 3 don't want to mislead the Board, there will be 4 openings, but not electric. 5 We have to, correct? 6 MR. BUSANIC: Yes. There are 7 street openings for the sanitary and storm 8 sewer. 9 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: On Willow 10 Avenue? 11 MR. BUSANIC: Yes. 12 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: You will 13 need a permit for that. 14 MR. MATULEA: Yes, we know that. 15 DIRECTOR MARKS: Mr. Chairman, I 16 have three questions or issues. 17 First, is the overhang actually 18 encroaching within the county right of way so 19 the hospital will need either a franchise 20 agreement or a license by the Board of Chosen 21 Freeholders. 22 MR. MATULEA: We will have to go 23 for the planter. Once they are finalized we 24 will get the metes and bounds and get that, 25 too. 191 1 DIRECTOR MARKS: Second, I 2 didn't see in the plans the tree details. Can 3 you just describe the tree specifications. 4 Please don't tell me they are 5 fences. 6 MR. BUSANIC: Initially we 7 followed the Hoboken tree detail which is 8 cobblestones flush with sidewalk. 9 After hearing some of the 10 previous applications, if the Board feels that 11 the tree grates are required, I am sure the 12 applicant will comply. 13 MR. HATIRAS: Whatever the Board 14 wishes on the trees we will do. 15 MR. BUSANIC: The existing trees 16 on Willow Avenue do have the cobblestone 17 pavers flush with the sidewalk. 18 DIRECTOR MARKS: Mr. Chairman, 19 as long as under ADA guidelines there cannot 20 be more than I think a quarter inch difference 21 between cobblestones or pavers, so as long as 22 they are consistent with that I wouldn't have 23 a problem with that. 24 And the third is -- I believe 25 the project is actually under construction 192 1 right now and I believe the hospital has 2 already erected scaffolding within the county 3 right of way without permits and I would 4 direct the hospital to get permits along 5 Willow Avenue. 6 MR. MATULEA: If I could, I 7 would like to address that. 8 What's been underway, they 9 started doing some site work tearing up the 10 old parking lot and driving some test piles. 11 The Hoboken Police Department 12 and the Hoboken Fire Department require the 13 scaffolding to be put up, but we will apply 14 for whatever permits are necessary. 15 We don't have any building 16 permits as such yet pending county approval. 17 I have no other testimony. If 18 the there is any other questions any of the 19 Board members have. 20 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Any 21 questions? 22 MR. KLEIN: No. 23 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Anybody 24 have a question? 25 Commissioner Holloway. 193 1 COMMISSIONER HOLLOWAY: I would 2 like to make a motion to approve. 3 COMMISSIONER BETTINGER: I will 4 second the motion. 5 DIRECTOR MARKS: Mr. Chairman, 6 on a motion to approve application 2007-081-SP 7 made by Commissioner Holloway and seconded by 8 Commissioner Bettinger, Commissioner 9 Arencibia? 10 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: Aye. 11 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 12 Bettinger? 13 COMMISSIONER BETTINGER: Aye. 14 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 15 Choffo? 16 COMMISSIONER CHOFFO: Aye. 17 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 18 DiDomenico? 19 COMMISSIONER DIDOMENICO: Aye. 20 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 21 Holloway? 22 COMMISSIONER HOLLOWAY: Aye. 23 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 24 Mehta? 25 COMMISSIONER MEHTA: Aye. 194 1 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 2 Munoz? 3 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: One 4 question. 5 Approvals are with the 6 recommendations you made? 7 DIRECTOR MARKS: Yes. 8 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: Yes. 9 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 10 Ng? 11 COMMISSIONER NG: Aye. 12 DIRECTOR MARKS: Chairman 13 Fitzgibbons? 14 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Aye. 15 DIRECTOR MARKS: Mr. Chairman, 16 the motion passes. 17 MR. MATULEA: Thank you for your 18 time. 19 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Recess 20 for about five minutes. 21 DIRECTOR MARKS: All in favor? 22 (Round of Ayes.) 23 (Time noted: 10:00 o'clock 24 p.m.) 25 (Whereupon, a recess was taken.) 195 1 2 P R O C E E D I N G S R E S U M E 3 (Whereupon, the proceedings 4 resume with all parties present.) 5 (Time noted: 10:15 p.m.) 6 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: What is 7 the time restraints? 8 DIRECTOR MARKS: According to 9 the bylaws adopted by the Planning Board, in 10 order to go after eleven o'clock you need a 11 two thirds majority vote. 12 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: We have 13 to makes that decision now. 14 DIRECTOR MARKS: You may want to 15 make it at 11:00. Depending on everybody's 16 schedule. 17 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Let's try 18 to move this as fast as we can. I hope we 19 don't have much trouble as we did before. 20 MS. LADD: My name is Patricia 21 Ladd. We are the last item on your agenda 22 this evening and what we were asking at this 23 time is if the Board feels appropriate, if 24 they can hear us because we have a very small, 25 very small application which involves getting 196 1 a water line into -- the water line into the 2 property and we are -- we were stopped at the 3 a juncture and we would love to be able to 4 start working very soon and I just wondered 5 because you are -- it will be another whole 6 month that we will not be able to work at the 7 job. 8 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: I think we 9 should finish all the applications that were 10 put on the agenda. 11 Who made the agenda? 12 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: We don't 13 do -- 14 DIRECTOR MARKS: The agenda, Mr. 15 Chairman, is a result of the site plan review 16 subcommittee which meets on the first 17 Wednesday of the month. 18 Those applications which are 19 ready for public hearing get scheduled. 20 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: They have 21 to limit to the applications we can hear, but 22 if the application had been put on the agenda 23 I think it is our duty to stay here until we 24 finish all the applications. 25 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Let's go 197 1 along right now and try to do the best we can. 2 DIRECTOR MARKS: Mr. Chairman, 3 the next application is 2008-004-SP, James 4 Napolitano, located on John F. Kennedy 5 Boulevard between 36th and 37th Streets which 6 is Block 260.01, Lots 19 through 25 and 49 7 through 53 in the City of Union City. 8 MR. ALONZO: Good evening, Mr. 9 Chairman, Members of the Board. 10 For the record, Al Alonzo on 11 behalf of the applicant. 12 This is for a new Commerce Bank 13 at the property just indicated by Mr. Marks. 14 We have -- I have two witnesses 15 this evening. 16 COMMISSIONER MEHTA: Attorney 17 Alonzo and I have a personal -- other than 18 this matter, but because of that I am excusing 19 myself from this case. 20 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Recuse 21 yourself, okay. 22 Continue. 23 MR. ALONZO: Mr. Chairman, I 24 have essentially two witnesses this evening, 25 our engineer and our traffic engineer, 198 1 although it is only my intention to call the 2 engineer to testify. 3 The plans have been submitted 4 and a traffic report was submitted by Joe 5 Steiger Engineering. 6 Everything has been reviewed by 7 T&M Associates. We have received and reviewed 8 correspondence from a representative from the 9 Board of Engineering. He has communicated 10 directly with T&M Associates and they have 11 addressed all the issues. 12 They have submitted revised 13 plans to the extent that they could and have 14 agreed that they could accommodate the other 15 conditions, so maybe we could revise plans in 16 the future. 17 With respect to Mr. Steiger, 18 again he has agreed to all the recommendations 19 made with respect to the traffic engineer, so 20 at this time -- one other thing is with 21 respect to Union City, the application is 22 currently pending and is scheduled for the May 23 8, 2008 agenda. 24 So we have not received approval 25 from that board yet. I will have Derek Jordan 199 1 be sworn in. 2 ATTORNEY CALVANICO: State your 3 name and spell your last name for the record. 4 MR. JORDAN: Derek Jordan, 5 J-O-R-D-A-N. 6 (Derek Jordan was duly sworn.) 7 MR. ALONSO: Mr. Jordan, can you 8 please review your professional qualifications 9 in engineering with the Board. 10 MR. JORDAN: Ohio Northern 11 University practicing civil engineering for 12 approximately five years now. 13 I am a licensed electrical 14 engineer in New Jersey. 15 MR. ALONZO: Have you been 16 qualified by other boards in the past? 17 MR. JORDAN: Not this Board, but 18 other boards in the State of New Jersey. 19 MR. ALONSO: I would ask that 20 his qualifications be accepted. 21 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Yes. 22 MR. ALONSO: Mr. Jordan, where 23 are you currently employed? 24 MR. JORDAN: Bohler Engineering. 25 MR. ALONZO: Is Bohler 200 1 Engineering prepared to testify in connection 2 with this application? 3 MR. JORDAN: Yes. 4 MR. ALONZO: And you have some 5 exhibits with you? 6 MR. JORDAN: Yes, I do 7 I want to go through two 8 exhibits. I have premarked this Exhibit A-1. 9 It is the survey that was 10 submitted as part of the site plan as Quality 11 Control Point Associates. 12 Just to orient the Board, the 13 top of the page is approximately north, the 14 site is located on Kennedy Boulevard in 15 between 37th Street and 36th Street. 16 The site is currently a vacant 17 lot. Previously a car dealership. 18 There is a single curb cut near 19 the intersection of 37th Street and Kennedy 20 Boulevard. The rest of the site is currently 21 a mixture of gravel and dirt. 22 Are there any questions at all 23 on this? 24 Next I would like to present the 25 site plan which I premarked A-2. This is the 201 1 entire site plan set submitted as part of the 2 site plan package and I will specifically 3 reference the site plan sheet which is sheet 4 three. 5 For this we are proposing a 6 Commerce Bank -- 7 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Commerce 8 Bank with four drive-through lanes located 9 fronting Kennedy Boulevard? 10 MR. JORDAN: I should know that. 11 The exit sits on the curb cut located near the 12 intersection of 37th and Kennedy and is 13 proposed to be closed, eliminating that curb 14 cut, and two driveways, one onto 36th and one 15 onto 37th which are each one way streets. 16 We have parking behind the bank 17 with the bank pulled up near Kennedy Boulevard 18 similar to others in the area and detached. 19 Two walk-up ramps, one in the 20 front of the building for pedestrians walking 21 along Kennedy, one in the rear of the building 22 for the patrons who work. Typical of 23 Commerce. They do not have a ramp in the 24 drive-through. 25 MR. ALONZO: This Exhibit A-2, 202 1 what is the last revision date? 2 MR. JORDAN: The last revision 3 date is 4-14-08. We revised these plans on 4 that date pursuant to the April 1st, 2008 5 letter we received from T&M Associates. 6 We revised them and we 7 resubmitted them to T&M. I know they are 8 under review, but we have agreed to agree to 9 all the comments on that letter. 10 MR. ALONZO: Who other 11 questions? 12 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Was it a 13 car dealership there? 14 MR. JORDAN: Yes. 15 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: There was 16 a structure there at one time. 17 MR. ALONSO: I am familiar with 18 the area and there was a new car dealership on 19 this site. 20 Across the street on the east 21 side of Kennedy Boulevard there was a new car 22 dealership and the mechanic bays, and on the 23 same side of the Boulevard to the south on the 24 next block was the used car dealership. It 25 was all one dealership. 203 1 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: Are there 2 any plans to plant trees around the building? 3 MR. JORDAN: Yes. A landscaping 4 plan is part of our submission as well. The 5 trees we are proposing to plant are on the 6 rear of the property along 36th and 37th. 7 The plans show planting a 8 significant amount of shrubs and lower growth 9 material up here. Flowered plants here in 10 order to maintain site distance and site 11 triangles in those intersections. 12 DIRECTOR MARKS: Mr. Chairman, 13 the site has approximately 120 feet of 14 frontage along Kennedy Boulevard and it was 15 the recommendation of the site plan committee 16 to plant four shade trees along this site. 17 It is Item No. 7 in the comment 18 letter from my office dated April 11, so I 19 would recommend that the applicant include 20 four new shade trees along Kennedy Boulevard. 21 MR. ALONSO: That is not a 22 problem. 23 MR. JORDAN: We will agree to do 24 that. 25 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Do we 204 1 have any comment from the members? 2 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: T&M 3 Associates made the review. 4 COMMISSIONER HOLLOWAY: Mr. 5 Chairman, I have a question, if I may. 6 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Yes. 7 COMMISSIONER HOLLOWAY: The 8 conditions of the sidewalk on Kennedy 9 Boulevard. 10 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: This is 11 -- the sidewalk was replaced or for this 12 project, Section 14. 13 It is brand new, but they are 14 going to close off the one driveway, is that 15 correct? 16 MR. JORDAN: Correct. 17 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: The 18 picture, can you explain that? 19 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: I 20 didn't take those pictures. 21 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: The 22 notations made on the picture with regard to 23 any -- 24 MR. TRIDENTE: I will address 25 that. 205 1 Commissioners, in your packet 2 you will notice that there is photograph at 3 the corner of 36th and Kennedy Boulevard. I 4 ask that the applicant make immediate contact 5 with the contractor to have a repositional 6 fence. It seems to be indented in the corner 7 there and there is an extreme trip hazard. 8 There is a lot of debris in the 9 corner there and I ask that you address that 10 immediately. 11 MR. ALONSO: Fine. 12 MR. JORDAN: We will contact the 13 contractor. 14 MR. TRIDENTE: And also on the 15 37th Street side where the proposed driveway 16 is going to be, how would you address the 17 tie-down for the telephone poles? There is a 18 support for the telephone pole right in the 19 middle of the driveway. 20 MR. JORDAN: That will have to 21 be re -- that will be coordinated with the 22 telephone company. 23 MR. TRIDENTE: No further 24 questions. 25 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: You have 206 1 to have approval from the Union City Planning 2 Board. 3 MR. ALONZO: That is scheduled 4 for May 8. 5 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: If we do 6 decide to approve this it will be upon the 7 approval of the Union City Planning Board. 8 MR. ALONSO: That's correct. 9 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: And if 10 they don't approve it, it will be null and 11 void. 12 MR. ALONSO: Absolutely. 13 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Any other 14 questions? 15 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: I would 16 make a motion to approve with the preface it 17 has to be approved by the Union County 18 Planning Board. 19 COMMISSIONER HOLLOWAY: I will 20 second it. 21 DIRECTOR MARKS: Mr. Chairman, 22 on a motion to approve application 2008-004-SP 23 made by Commissioner Munoz and seconded by 24 Commissioner Holloway, Commissioner Arencibia? 25 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: Aye. 207 1 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 2 Bettinger? 3 COMMISSIONER BETTINGER: Aye. 4 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 5 Choffo? 6 COMMISSIONER CHOFFO: Aye. 7 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 8 DiDomenico? 9 COMMISSIONER DIDOMENICO: Aye. 10 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 11 Holloway? 12 COMMISSIONER HOLLOWAY: Aye. 13 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 14 Mehta? 15 COMMISSIONER MEHTA: Aye. 16 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 17 Ng? 18 COMMISSIONER NG: Aye. 19 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 20 Munoz? 21 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: Aye. 22 DIRECTOR MARKS: Chairman 23 Fitzgibbons? 24 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Yes. 25 DIRECTOR MARKS: The motion 208 1 passes. 2 The next application scheduled 3 for public hearing is 2008-011-SP, Block 114 4 Development, LLC, located at 321-1325 Adams 5 Street, Block 11-13 and parts of 14 through 17 6 in the City of Hoboken. 7 MR. CURLEY: John Curley, 8 C-U-R-L-E-Y. I represent the applicant. 9 This is a rather straightforward 10 residential project. It is located in Hoboken 11 on Adams street near Fourteenth Street. It is 12 part of the same subdivision as the Grand 13 Street project approved at the last meeting 14 and for which we had a memorialized resolution 15 tonight. 16 It is part of that project and 17 also the cinema projects. All of that land 18 was approved for subdivision by the County 19 Board on November 19th, 2007 and this is the 20 third and final site plan application arising 21 out of that subdivision. 22 I would like to call Andy Missey 23 who is the civil engineer to present the site 24 plan. 25 MR. MISSEY: I was sworn the 209 1 last time on this. 2 ATTORNEY CALVANICO: Consider 3 yourself previously sworn. 4 MR. MISSEY: Thank you. 5 For the record, my name is 6 Andrew Missey with Lapatka Associates. 7 As Mr. Curley advised you, this 8 is a project on Adams Street immediately 9 adjoining the Grand Street residential 10 projects which site plan approval was 11 memorialized earlier this evening and also the 12 cinema site plan which we discussed at the 13 outset tonight. 14 This particular lot on Adams is 15 10,000 square feet in area. A one hundred by 16 one hundred lot. 17 Right now it is vacant and it is 18 in Hoboken's residential redevelopment zone. 19 All the utilities to serve this 20 building will come from the utilities that are 21 right now in the street -- in the road of 22 Adams Street. 23 There will be no cuts into 24 Fourteenth Street necessary to develop this 25 site. 210 1 The building occupies 90 percent 2 of the site. The ten feet closest to the 3 Adams Street right of way line will consist of 4 landscaping and also the stoops that are 5 characteristics of the new development in this 6 area. 7 The building itself will be 8 garage and lobby space at the ground level or 9 the street level, and above that will be five 10 stories of residential space. There will be 11 seven one-bedroom apartments and eighteen 12 two-bedroom apartments. 13 The back 30 feet of this 14 property will be the courtyard located on top 15 of the garage roof which is also 16 characteristic of this section of Hoboken. 17 We have received at this time 18 the will serve letters from both North Hudson 19 Sewage Authority and Hoboken Water for our 20 utilities for potable water and sanitary 21 sewerage. 22 With respect to storm drainage, 23 we will propose and have included in our 24 design a detention system to be located 25 beneath the garage slab. This was also what 211 1 we did for the Grand Street residential 2 progress that I presented to you last month. 3 The system is very similar in 4 design and the real difference here is solely 5 that this is a smaller site and requires a 6 slightly smaller detention. 7 North Hudson Sewage Authority 8 will ultimately be the approving entity for 9 that detention system. 10 That really is in a nutshell 11 what this project is about so I will answer 12 any questions you might have. 13 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: I have a 14 question. Hoboken Water Authority is United 15 Water. There is no Hoboken Water Authority. 16 MR. MISSEY: That is correct. 17 It is Hoboken Water Services and United Water 18 is operates it. 19 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Actually 20 they own everything, United Water. 21 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: Mr. 22 Chairman? 23 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Yes. 24 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: Is this the 25 same developer that is developing the single 212 1 one? 2 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Same 3 development, that is why the community, they 4 are building them. 5 Actually it is part -- we 6 already approved part of this development. 7 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: How many 8 parking spaces roughly are you going to have 9 on the bottom? 10 MR. MISSEY: Twenty-five spaces 11 on the side for the 25 units above. 12 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: Isn't there 13 space to build another garage there for the 14 cinema? 15 MR. MISSEY: No. There is not. 16 Different area. 17 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: This was 18 all approved by the Planning Board, right? 19 MR. MISSEY: That's correct. 20 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: And the 21 city counsel? 22 MR. MISSEY: Yes. 23 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Do you 24 have any questions? 25 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: No. 213 1 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Nothing 2 to do with the county road? 3 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: Not 4 fronting a county road. 5 COMMISSIONER HOLLOWAY: Motion 6 to approve. 7 COMMISSIONER CHOFFO: I will 8 second it. 9 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: We have a 10 motion. 11 DIRECTOR MARKS: Mr. Chairman, 12 on a motion to approve application 2008-011-SP 13 made by Commissioner Holloway and seconded by 14 Commissioner Choffo, Commissioner Arencibia? 15 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: Aye. 16 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 17 Bettinger? 18 COMMISSIONER BETTINGER: Aye. 19 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 20 Choffo? 21 COMMISSIONER CHOFFO: Aye. 22 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 23 DiDomenico? 24 COMMISSIONER DIDOMENICO: Aye. 25 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 214 1 Holloway? 2 COMMISSIONER HOLLOWAY: Aye. 3 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 4 Mehta? 5 COMMISSIONER MEHTA: Aye. 6 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 7 Munoz? 8 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: Abstain. 9 DIRECTOR MARKS: Okay. 10 Commissioner Ng? 11 COMMISSIONER NG: Abstain. 12 DIRECTOR MARKS: And Chairman 13 Fitzgibbons. 14 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Yes. 15 DIRECTOR MARKS: Mr. Chairman, 16 motion passes. 17 MR. CURLEY: Thank you. 18 MR. MISSEY: Thank you. 19 DIRECTOR MARKS: Mr. Chairman, 20 the next application scheduled for public 21 hearing is 2008-023-SP, 313 Jefferson Trust 22 LLC. 23 MR. MATULEA: Robert Matulea 24 appearing on behalf of the applicant. 25 Good evening. Our architect Ron 215 1 Russel and Mr. Ramone had conversations this 2 afternoon. There are some issues they still 3 need to work out, so subsequently we are 4 asking this matter be carried to the May 21 5 agenda. 6 They have a meeting set up for 7 next week. They will meet and go over and 8 resolve a couple of issues on the plans and we 9 would like to come back and present it on May 10 21st. 11 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Do we 12 have a motion to table this to May 21? 13 COMMISSIONER BETTINGER: I will 14 make a motion. 15 COMMISSIONER MEHTA: I will 16 second. 17 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: To carry. 18 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Yes. 19 Make a motion to carry to the 20 next meeting. 21 MR. MATULEA: Thank you. I hope 22 that helps you move the agenda along. 23 DIRECTOR MARKS: Mr. Chairman, 24 on a motion to table and carry application 25 2008-023-SP to the next meeting made by 216 1 Commissioner Bettinger and seconded by 2 Commissioner Mehta, Commissioner Arencibia? 3 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: Aye. 4 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 5 Bettinger? 6 COMMISSIONER BETTINGER: Aye. 7 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 8 Choffo? 9 COMMISSIONER CHOFFO: Aye. 10 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 11 DiDomenico? 12 COMMISSIONER DIDOMENICO: Aye. 13 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 14 Holloway? 15 COMMISSIONER HOLLOWAY: Aye. 16 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 17 Mehta? 18 COMMISSIONER MEHTA: Aye. 19 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 20 Munoz? 21 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: Aye. 22 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 23 Ng? 24 COMMISSIONER NG: Aye. 25 DIRECTOR MARKS: Chairman 217 1 Fitzgibbons? 2 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Aye. 3 DIRECTOR MARKS: Mr. Chairman, 4 the motion passes. 5 Mr. Chairman, the next 6 application scheduled for public hearing is 7 2008-025-SP, Thomas Clenaghan, applicant, 8 located at 247 Pearsall Avenue which is Block 9 1373, Lot 44.E in the City of Jersey City. 10 Mr. Chairman, we have a letter 11 which is in your packet from Mr. Clenaghan 12 requesting that the matter be I believe 13 adjourned, but we do have a member of the 14 general public who has come to comment on the 15 matter. 16 MR. McCANN: My name is Thomas 17 McCann, M-c-C-A-N-N and I am an objector to 18 this application. 19 I have some pictures I would 20 like to share with the Board. I will be brief 21 and I will try to move real fast. 22 I am here to request that the 23 Board deny the request for a carport at this 24 location. 25 These are my reasons. First 218 1 problem is that this applicant had no respect 2 for the law, the county, or their neighbors. 3 They went and completely paved 4 two back yards causing drainage problems and 5 cut through the county's curb creating an 6 illegal driveway and eliminated much needed 7 parking in our neighborhood. 8 Paving yards causes ponding and 9 drainage in problems for surrounding 10 neighbors. 11 The creation of this driveway 12 eliminates two parking spaces the Boulevard. 13 All this applicant can store on 14 its property is two parking spots. This does 15 not help our neighborhood, it only helps the 16 applicant. 17 Every person including myself 18 should have as much right to these parking 19 spots as anyone else. If cars are parked in 20 front of other cars as you could see in one of 21 the pictures, the inside cars will be trapped 22 next to the houses. 23 This is unacceptable. This same 24 building was gutted by fire several years ago 25 due to carelessness. 219 1 The history is there. If a 2 vehicle caught fire and was trapped behind 3 cars against the building would burn along 4 with other homes nearby. 5 What they did was they put in an 6 application for two parking spots illegally. 7 They never had the Planning Board's approval 8 and they have been putting four cars in here 9 anyway which would trap the first two cars in 10 there. 11 In a recent picture it shows 12 they put as many cars as they could in this 13 area. 14 This is as illegal now as it 15 was there then but from north to Pearsall on 16 the east side of Kennedy Boulevard exist two 17 businesses. One is a children's daycare and 18 the other is a beauty hair salon. 19 Just recently on the corner of 20 Pearsall a deli -- the same side, a deli 21 opened in the same building with the Kennedy 22 Boulevard address. 23 We have all three buildings on 24 this side of the Boulevard which now have 25 businesses. This is increasing parking on the 220 1 Boulevard on Pearsall. 2 Also existing in this area are 3 five more businesses and a church, a liquor 4 store, a realtor, another deli, a dentist, an 5 insurance business, all within in a two-block 6 radius. 7 The problem with this 8 application is that the address on the 9 application is for 247 Pearsall. There is no 10 247 Pearsall. The applicant lied. 11 The address is 1662 Kennedy 12 Boulevard. They used -- the people at 243 13 wanted the parking so what they use was they 14 used 243 and 245 and 247 in their application. 15 There is no 247. 16 The 247 is clearly 1662 Kennedy 17 Boulevard, so the applicant lied on their 18 permit to the Planning Board. 19 There is no address 247 Pearsall 20 Avenue and you can see that on the pictures 21 what they claim is 247 Pearsall is actually 22 1662. 23 The other thing, too, is this 24 1662 isn't deep enough to allow a carport. 25 The width of the back of the building is only 221 1 ten foot. 2 So I know that a setback 18 foot 3 is standard in any municipality. The new deli 4 on Pearsall and the building is 1662 and how 5 can 247 be considered 1662, it is clear. 6 In order to pave 243 Pearsall 7 Avenue, this owner submitted the paperwork 8 under 247. 9 The picture of the four cars is 10 one thing I submitted. This also a letter of 11 November 27 from the county engineer to the 12 code enforcement official from Jersey City, 13 Ray Meyers, about the owner of 243, 245 14 Pearsall Avenue with an illegal curb cut. 15 I think Commissioner Arencibia 16 can testify to that also. The pictures of 17 1662 Boulevard were illegal, the applicant 18 said that it was 247 which was illegal. 19 This applicant is self-serving, 20 has misrepresented everything from the start 21 to the present. Myself and my neighbors 22 request that this request be denied. 23 Also for your information 24 neither 1662 Boulevard nor what they want you 25 to think is 247 Pearsall is deep enough and 222 1 the, where they are trying to put the carport 2 doesn't actually abut the Boulevard. It is 3 actually three houses in, so I appreciate that 4 if you considered my testimony and consider 5 this application and deny it. 6 Thank you so much. 7 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: I got 8 questions, Thomas. 9 Did the Jersey City Planning 10 Board approve this? 11 MR. McCANN: They had no 12 approvals and I think Mr. Arencibia -- as a 13 matter of fact, I actually have a letter from 14 the county engineer to one of the applicants 15 who denied their permit of application for a 16 driveway cut, so this was from the county 17 engineer. 18 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: My 19 question is this: What enforcement did the 20 city of Jersey City do? Did they go after the 21 owner? 22 MR. McCANN: It did the illegal 23 curb cut on the county road, so the county 24 went after the owner. 25 The county engineer actually 223 1 sent a letter to the owner, actually, and 2 Mario actually sent out a notice of violation. 3 Mario, is this from you? Is 4 that right? 5 MR. TRIDENTE: Yes. 6 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: They were 7 caught using an a/k/a address, also known as? 8 MR. McCANN: Yes. 9 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: If they 10 didn't get approval from the Planning Board 11 not only should the county have gone after 12 them but the Jersey City enforcement should go 13 after them, too, for illegally putting a 14 driveway there. 15 MR. McCANN: What they 16 originally requested, they requested the 17 driveway onto 243 around the house. It is a 18 six-family house. 19 Actually they made a five-family 20 into a six-family illegally also, but what 21 they did was they put an application in for a 22 carport under 243 and put the carport behind 23 the building and they came in through Kennedy 24 Boulevard. 25 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Is that 224 1 building a corner piece of property? 2 MR. McCANN: No. It is the 3 third house in off the Boulevard and they are 4 applying to you to put a carport three houses 5 in from the Boulevard. 6 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: You just 7 told me they did an illegal conversion from a 8 five to a six-unit house? 9 MR. McCANN: Yes, they did, and 10 their problem is also with the Planning Board, 11 with the City Planning Board, but I think 12 after all of their finagling they might 13 finally have an approval for the change, but 14 they don't have an approval for the -- they 15 never had approval for the curb cut. 16 As a matter of fact, they did 17 the curb cut in September of -- or July of 18 2007 and the county finally took them to 19 court. 20 The county did take them to 21 court right away, but it took them like six 22 months to finally put the curb back in. 23 But the County Planning Board 24 and the County Engineer made sure that this 25 person did not get away with their illegal 225 1 cut. 2 DIRECTOR MARKS: Mr. Chairman? 3 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Mr. 4 Secretary. 5 DIRECTOR MARKS: In your packets 6 this evening is a letter from 243-245 Pearsall 7 Avenue Condo Association, Inc., addressing 243 8 Pearsall Avenue, Jersey City, New Jersey 07035 9 dated April 16, 2008 requesting that the 10 application be formally withdrawn. 11 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: So now 12 actually the application is being withdrawn so 13 it is out of our jurisdiction, but if they did 14 an illegal driveway on a county road it still 15 falls under our jurisdiction. 16 DIRECTOR MARKS: The County took 17 them to court and they were ordered by the 18 Jersey City Municipal Court, I believe, to 19 remove -- 20 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: They 21 were ordered by Jersey City Housing Court. 22 DIRECTOR MARKS: -- to remove 23 the curb cut and they also had without permits 24 or approvals paved over the backyard for a 25 parking lot and I believe they were ordered to 226 1 remove both the curb cut and the asphalt. 2 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: And it is 3 also a zoning matter, too, isn't it? That is 4 a zoning problem, too. 5 The zoning officer of Jersey 6 City should have went after them, too. 7 MR. McCANN: I came here just to 8 make sure you guys helped me and my neighbors 9 out to make sure these people didn't get away 10 with anything. 11 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: They 12 ain't getting away with it here. 13 MR. McCANN: I appreciate the 14 time and it was a pleasure talking to you. 15 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: It is off 16 the agenda. 17 DIRECTOR MARKS: There is a 18 request from the applicants to formally 19 withdraw their applications, so it would 20 probably deserve a motion and a vote to accept 21 their request to withdraw the application. 22 ATTORNEY CALVANICO: Mr. 23 Chairman, just so the record is clear, the 24 Zoning Department of Jersey City has filed a 25 notice of violation. 227 1 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: Just 2 from the County Engineer's end, the 3 proceeding, the court proceedings ended on 4 March 13th with a final outcome that the owner 5 was fined $12,000 by the judge for 6 constructing the driveway without a permit and 7 paving the driveway without a permit and he 8 recently installed the curb back in its 9 original condition, but as far as the parking 10 lot, I don't know if he has restored that. 11 That is going to be a matter up 12 to Jersey City to go resolve that. But the 13 owner was fined about $12,000. 14 MR. McCANN: Thank you all so 15 much. 16 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: He got 17 hit over the head with a hammer. 18 MR. McCANN: That you so much. 19 COMMISSIONER DIDOMENICO: Thank 20 you for coming and waiting until the a quarter 21 to eleven to be able to give us all that 22 information. 23 MR. McCANN: It was worth it. 24 Thank you so much. 25 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Do we 228 1 have a motion? 2 COMMISSIONER CHOFFO: I will 3 make a motion to officially withdraw the 4 application. 5 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: I will 6 second. 7 DIRECTOR MARKS: Mr. Chairman, 8 on a motion to withdraw application 9 2008-025-SP made by Commissioner Choffo and 10 seconded by Commissioner Munoz, Commissioner 11 Arencibia? 12 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: Aye. 13 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 14 Bettinger? 15 COMMISSIONER BETTINGER: Aye. 16 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 17 Choffo? 18 COMMISSIONER CHOFFO: Aye. 19 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 20 DiDomenico? 21 COMMISSIONER DIDOMENICO: Aye. 22 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 23 Holloway? 24 COMMISSIONER HOLLOWAY: Aye. 25 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 229 1 Mehta? 2 COMMISSIONER MEHTA: Aye. 3 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 4 Munoz? 5 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: Aye. 6 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 7 Ng? 8 COMMISSIONER NG: Aye. 9 DIRECTOR MARKS: Chairman 10 Fitzgibbons? 11 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Aye. 12 DIRECTOR MARKS: Mr. Chairman, 13 the motion passes. 14 Mr. Chairman, the next 15 application scheduled for public hearing is 16 2008-032-SP, Dragonfly Development, LLC. 17 Mr. Chairman, we received a 18 request from the applicant's attorney to 19 basically table or adjourn this matter until 20 next month so. 21 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: There is 22 a light at the end of the tunnel over here. 23 COMMISSIONER HOLLOWAY: I will 24 make a motion to adjourn it for the next 25 meeting. 230 1 COMMISSIONER MEHTA: Second. 2 DIRECTOR MARKS: Who made the 3 motion? 4 COMMISSIONER HOLLOWAY: I did. 5 DIRECTOR MARKS: Mr. Chairman, 6 on a motion to adjourn application 2008-032-SP 7 made by Commissioner Holloway and seconded by 8 Commissioner Mehta, Commissioner Arencibia? 9 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: Aye. 10 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 11 Bettinger? 12 COMMISSIONER BETTINGER: Aye. 13 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 14 Choffo? 15 COMMISSIONER CHOFFO: Aye. 16 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 17 DiDomenico? 18 COMMISSIONER DIDOMENICO: Aye. 19 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 20 Holloway? 21 COMMISSIONER HOLLOWAY: Aye. 22 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 23 Mehta? 24 COMMISSIONER MEHTA: Aye. 25 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 231 1 Munoz? 2 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: Aye. 3 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 4 Ng? 5 COMMISSIONER NG: Aye. 6 DIRECTOR MARKS: Chairman 7 Fitzgibbons? 8 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Yes. 9 DIRECTOR MARKS: Mr. Chairman, 10 the motion passed. 11 The next application scheduled 12 for public hearing is 2008-35-SP, Stateside 13 Title, LLC, located at 313-315 Frank E. 14 Rodgers Boulevard, Block 29, Lots 1 and 2 in 15 the Town of Harrison. 16 MR. BENNETT: Good evening. 17 Gary Bennett, B-E-N-N-E-T-T, appearing on 18 behalf of the applicant, Stateside Title, LLC. 19 The application that comes 20 before you is an application that was approved 21 by the Harrison Planning Board. It is to take 22 property at the corner of Cross Street and 23 Frank E. Rodgers Boulevard which is a county 24 road. 25 It consists of two buildings, a 232 1 block building that faces out on Frank E. 2 Rodgers Boulevard, 50 by 100 feet, 50 feet 3 being across the frontage on the Boulevard 4 side. 5 The block building that faces on 6 Frank E. Rodgers Boulevard has been 7 historically a garage and tire changing 8 facility. It is in deplorable condition. 9 Behind it is what has for many 10 years been a landmark in Harrison known as 11 Dumphries Hawaiian Palms, a restaurant and 12 banquet hall. It hasn't been utilized in 13 almost 12 to 14 years. 14 Stateside Title through their 15 principal Gary Weiss is who is here this 16 evening with me has purchased the property. 17 The proposal that was approved 18 by the Board in which we come before you is to 19 reconstruct the former bar restaurant banquet 20 hall building, demolish the existing 21 deplorable block facility, close a 35 and a 22 half foot driveway plus curb cut on Frank E. 23 Rodgers Boulevard, replace it with two parking 24 spaces, restore two parking spaces to a county 25 road, plant a shade tree in front of it, 233 1 completely renovate the building, put a 2 new facade on it, provide off-street parking 3 and that's it. 4 I have got the architect who 5 prepared the plans, and he is here this 6 evening. 7 This is the plan. I would 8 respectfully submit it is nothing but a 9 positive from the county's perspective and I 10 can assure you the town of Harrison perceives 11 it in the same fashion. 12 I say it is a positive because 13 it restores parking, it will create a new 14 curb, create -- it actually closes down the 15 curb cut along cross street, so overall it 16 benefits the community, it benefits the 17 county. 18 As I say, we have also shown 19 there will be four shade trees planted. 20 I received a memorandum with 21 regard to the application, had an opportunity 22 to review it with the applicant as well as the 23 architect, and we are in total agreement with 24 everything set forth there. 25 Many of the items are technical 234 1 in nature such as adding on the county's 2 signature block. Absolutely no problem in 3 doing that and submitting as-built drawings. 4 In addition, one of the 5 substantive items noted by Mr. Marks is that 6 under the residential site improvement 7 standards it would be a necessity for six and 8 a half parking spaces where we are only 9 providing five. 10 The municipality reviewed that 11 as well and gave us a diminimus exception to 12 that requirement based on the fact we are 13 restoring on-street parking and creating five 14 off-street parking spaces where none existed 15 previously. 16 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: The five 17 spaces are going to be used for residential or 18 commercial? 19 MR. BENNETT: Interchanged one 20 commercial space withing the building and the 21 Board's perception of that and our testimony 22 before the Board was that it is going to be an 23 office. 24 It is not going to be a 25 commercial use, it is going to be an office 235 1 space basically a 9:00 to 5:00 office and the 2 residents would be able to use some of that 3 parking during the evening, but by restoring 4 the two spots on the site it was also 5 providing additional on-street parking where 6 none existed. 7 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Do we 8 have anything? 9 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: As the 10 plan shows, there is a new curb and new 11 sidewalk for the entire property? 12 MR. BENNETT: That's correct. 13 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: You 14 also need to show the handicapped ramps on the 15 corner. They are not shown on the plan. 16 MR. BENNETT: Okay. 17 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: The red 18 grip pad has to be provided a detail for that, 19 a detail for the nine by 18 DOT curb has to be 20 shown around the trees. I guess the details 21 from the trees. 22 What type of trees were you 23 going to install? 24 MR. BENNETT: Shade trees at the 25 direction of the town of Harrison. 236 1 Mr. Marks recommends they be at 2 least three and a half inches and we are happy 3 to do that, shade tree type. 4 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: How many? 5 MR. BENNETT: Four. 6 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: You 7 need a permit from the county. 8 MR. BENNETT: Also contained in 9 Mr. Marks' correspondence, and we will apply 10 for that definitely. 11 COMMISSIONER CHOFFO: Mr. 12 Chairman? 13 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Yes. 14 COMMISSIONER CHOFFO: I think 15 all the applicants, the applicants in their 16 towns -- I live in Harrison -- would create 17 more on-street parking rather than take it 18 away, so I applaud you and I live around the 19 corner. 20 I know a lot of the residents 21 have been looking forward to it. Over 15 22 years it has been closed. 23 MR. BENNETT: Thank you. 24 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Any other 25 questions? 237 1 Motion to approve? 2 COMMISSIONER HOLLOWAY: Motion 3 to approve. 4 COMMISSIONER CHOFFO: Second. 5 DIRECTOR MARKS: Mr. Chairman, I 6 don't know how close Commissioner Choffo 7 lives, if he is within 200 feet you shouldn't 8 vote. 9 Did you get notice of this when 10 he applied for it? 11 COMMISSIONER CHOFFO: I think I 12 did. When it came in front of the town. 13 DIRECTOR MARKS: You should 14 abstain. 15 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: I need 16 another second. 17 COMMISSIONER BETTINGER: Yes, I 18 will second. 19 DIRECTOR MARKS: Mr. Chairman, 20 on a motion to approve application 2008-035-SP 21 made by Commissioner Holloway and seconded by 22 Commissioner Bettinger, Commissioner 23 Arencibia? 24 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: Aye. 25 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 238 1 Bettinger? 2 COMMISSIONER BETTINGER: Aye. 3 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 4 Choffo? 5 COMMISSIONER CHOFFO: Abstain. 6 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 7 DiDomenico? 8 COMMISSIONER DIDOMENICO: Aye. 9 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 10 Holloway? 11 COMMISSIONER HOLLOWAY: Aye. 12 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 13 Mehta? 14 COMMISSIONER MEHTA: Aye. 15 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 16 Munoz? 17 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: Aye. 18 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 19 Ng? 20 COMMISSIONER NG: Aye. 21 DIRECTOR MARKS: Chairman 22 Fitzgibbons? 23 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Aye. 24 DIRECTOR MARKS: Mr. Chairman, 25 the motion passes. 239 1 MR. BENNETT: Thank you very 2 much and thank you for hearing us this 3 evening. 4 DIRECTOR MARKS: Mr. Chairman, it 5 is just about 11:00. I believe the bylaws 6 call for a two thirds vote of the Board to 7 continue the public hearing. 8 COMMISSIONER BETTINGER: I will 9 make a motion to continue. 10 COMMISSIONER HOLLOWAY: Second 11 it. 12 DIRECTOR MARKS: Mr. Chairman, 13 on a motion to continue this meeting made by 14 Commissioner Bettinger and seconded by 15 Commissioner Holloway, Commissioner Arencibia? 16 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: Aye. 17 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 18 Bettinger? 19 COMMISSIONER BETTINGER: Aye. 20 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 21 Choffo? 22 COMMISSIONER CHOFFO: Aye. 23 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 24 DiDomenico? 25 COMMISSIONER DIDOMENICO: Aye. 240 1 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 2 Holloway? 3 COMMISSIONER HOLLOWAY: Aye. 4 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 5 Mehta? 6 COMMISSIONER MEHTA: Aye. 7 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 8 Munoz? 9 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: Aye. 10 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 11 Ng? 12 COMMISSIONER NG: Aye. 13 DIRECTOR MARKS: Chairman 14 Fitzgibbons? 15 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Aye. 16 DIRECTOR MARKS: Okay. 17 Mr. Chairman, the next 18 application scheduled for public hearing is 19 2008-037-SP, Adriano and Francisco Guia, 20 located at 4301 Bergen Turnpike, Block 103, 21 Lot 122 in the Township of North Bergen. 22 MR. ERCOLANO: Thomas Ercolano. 23 I am the architect for this project and I 24 would like to represent my client. The Guias 25 are here. 241 1 I earned a degree from Pratt 2 Institute in 1967. I have been licensed in 3 New Jersey since 1971. I appeared in front of 4 most of the Boards in the local area, recently 5 in Jersey City and Clifton and Belleville, and 6 I am also licensed in New York and 7 Pennsylvania. 8 It is a simple project. I think 9 with respect to the county road -- 10 ATTORNEY CALVANICO: Before you 11 begin I need to swear you in. 12 (Thomas Ercolano was duly 13 sworn.) 14 MR. ERCOLANO: 4301 Bergen 15 Turnpike is the site in question. The site is 16 25 feet wide by 132 feet deep. 17 The 25 foot side is the part 18 that touches Bergen Turnpike. It is located 19 on the corner on the southeast corner of 20 Bergen Turnpike and 43rd Street. 21 First of all what we are 22 proposing, the part shown in yellow is a 23 two-story building with a deli on the first 24 floor and two apartments on the second floor. 25 The part that is outlined in 242 1 green is a one-story bakery which is planned 2 to be demolished and then we will build a 3 three-story building which has four parking 4 spaces on, in a garage on the lowest level and 5 two apartments, one on each floor above that. 6 By the way, this has all been 7 approved by the North Bergen Planning Board 8 already. We have that approval and the 9 resolution was attached to it with the 10 application. 11 There were two comments from Mr. 12 Marks, one was to add a shade tree on the 13 frontage on Bergen Turnpike and to revise the 14 drawings. 15 In fact, I have revised the 16 drawings. I have four sets here. I added the 17 shade tree in this location and there is a 18 detail of the planting detail. 19 The other request was to have 20 the signature block, and I did that also. I 21 thought I would just bring them in revised 22 now. There is no change. 23 There was originally proposed to 24 be no work done on Bergen Turnpike but now we 25 are adding a tree. 243 1 I think those are the only 2 issues related to the county road. We have 3 four parking spaces for the two additional 4 apartments and that is more than is required 5 by the SR -- RSIS, so we exceed that 6 requirement. 7 Actually, we are adding the 8 parking. 9 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: Are you 10 replacing the sidewalks? 11 MR. ERCOLANO: We are replacing 12 the sidewalk just where we are doing our work. 13 These are existing sidewalks which our plan 14 was to keep. 15 There is actually a handicapped 16 spot at the corner but as it exists where we 17 cut our new curb cuts to get into this. 18 All of our work is 70 feet from 19 the Bergen Turnpike. All the work will be 20 done in the sidewalk. 21 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Do you 22 have any other questions? 23 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: Will the 24 sidewalk change the height from this picture 25 here towards the front? 244 1 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: The one 2 on 43rd Street? 3 MR. ERCOLANO: I didn't show 4 this Board, but there are some photos. The 5 existing two-story building we are keeping, 6 with the deli on the lower level is here and 7 that's about 70 feet from the corner of Bergen 8 Turnpike. 9 This is the new structure we are 10 proposing after we demolish the one-story 11 bakery. 12 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Mark that 13 as an exhibit. 14 (So marked.) 15 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: On 43rd 16 Street which is not a county road there are 17 open tree pits. Mr. Tridente was the one who 18 did the inspection. 19 MR. ERCOLANO: My survey shows 20 trees, but they just died. 21 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: What 22 are you proposing to do? 23 MR. ERCOLANO: We think the 24 Township of North Bergen is going to replace 25 the trees. They belong to -- 245 1 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: When did 2 they die? 3 MR. ERCOLANO: When did they 4 die? I don't know why they died, but we have 5 photos that show the trees and when my survey 6 was done by the surveyor, the trees were 7 there. 8 It is very recent. Maybe it 9 didn't have a fence around it. 10 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: All we 11 are worried about is the one tree located on 12 our county road right now. 13 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: What 14 kind of business is going to be at the corner? 15 ERCOLANO: It is an existing 16 deli. It is the same operators. Owner 17 operators. They are going to live on the top 18 floor of the apartment. 19 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: He is 20 saying it is not on a county road? 21 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: The pine 22 should be relocated. Is that going to be 23 demolished or this part here? 24 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: This is 25 the bakery. It is going to be demolished. 246 1 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: Should be 2 relocated or graded. 3 MR. ERCOLANO: May I look? 4 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: There is a 5 notation that was made to us on the picture 6 that trees should be relocated, the shade tree 7 should be relocated. 8 MR. TRIDENTE: I deem these 9 sidewalks unserviceable condition and 10 recommend they be replaced both on 43rd Street 11 and on the county road and while I was walking 12 along 43rd Street I did notice there is an 13 exhaust fan on the 43rd Street side at the 14 existing location that is not deemed for 15 demolition. 16 MR. ERCOLANO: That is being 17 removed. 18 MR. TRIDENTE: And I recommend 19 he remove it. 20 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: The chimney 21 may be removed. 22 MR. ERCOLANO: All of is that is 23 being removed. The unsightly thing, it is all 24 in the applications. 25 If you look at the applications, 247 1 we are redoing the kitchen and have exhausts 2 that wouldn't be visible, that wouldn't be 3 dripping from the side. 4 COMMISSIONER HOLLOWAY: Mr. 5 Chairman? 6 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: 7 Commissioner Holloway. 8 COMMISSIONER HOLLOWAY: I have 9 one question. The building that is staying, 10 that is not -- that demolition is going to be 11 gutted out? 12 MR. ERCOLANO: No. The 13 exterior. 14 COMMISSIONER HOLLOWAY: The 15 exterior is going to be finished? 16 MR. ERCOLANO: The mansard roof 17 is going, the mansard on top is going, this 18 treatment on the top is going, and it is all 19 going to be -- 20 COMMISSIONER HOLLOWAY: It is 21 all exterior? 22 MR. ERCOLANO: All exterior. We 23 are putting a new kitchen in the deli and that 24 is it. Those apartments stay. 25 COMMISSIONER HOLLOWAY: Thank 248 1 you. 2 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: The 3 applicants have no objection to any issue with 4 replacing the sidewalks and replacing the 5 trees that have died? 6 MR. ERCOLANO: I don't believe 7 they have an issue. 8 May I ask my client? 9 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Go 10 ahead. 11 (Whereupon, an off-the-record 12 discussion was held.) 13 MR. ERCOLANO: They will replace 14 the trees. I know of the large portion of the 15 sidewalk was planned to be replaced. 16 Are you requesting us to replace 17 this all the way around? 18 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: Let me 19 say the Bergen Turnpike is the county road we 20 are talking about here and for our end it has 21 to be done. 22 The corner to the property line 23 along Bergen Turnpike. 24 MR. ERCOLANO: This right of 25 way? 249 1 So you would like us to do this? 2 Once we do this, we will do that. But let's 3 just commit to the county part. 4 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: I have 5 no control over the other street. That, you 6 may have to talk to the town to get a permit 7 from the from them. 8 From the county end you also 9 have to do the curb because even on the 10 municipal street the curb is shot, too. 11 MR. ERCOLANO: Okay. I think we 12 will do that. 13 COMMISSIONER CHOFFO: You did 14 receive your approval from North Bergen? 15 MR. ERCOLANO: Yes. The 16 resolution is -- I attached it to the 17 application. 18 COMMISSIONER CHOFFO: All right. 19 It is quite a while ago. 20 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: There was 21 no discussion about the sidewalk in North 22 Bergen. 23 MR. ERCOLANO: No. Because we 24 had so many other issues I guess it got lost 25 in our discussions because it all got into 250 1 parking and number of units. 2 We originally had more units. 3 We cut them down to make them happy. 4 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Most of 5 these local boards, they get tied up into 6 parking and other stuff but they miss the 7 other part, the exterior, the sidewalks and 8 curb cuts. 9 MR. ERCOLANO: I know. We are 10 going to have all new sidewalks from here back 11 and I guess we are going to keep moving. We 12 will do the rest. 13 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: What we 14 worry about is the county portion. 15 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: Will 16 you need to do any utility openings on 43rd 17 Street? 18 MR. ERCOLANO: No. They are on 19 43rd Street but not Bergen Turnpike. You 20 meant Bergen Turnpike? 21 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: Yes. 22 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Can we 23 have a motion to approve on the recommendation 24 that they do the sidewalk. 25 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: Motion to 251 1 approve with the recommendation of the 2 sidewalk. 3 COMMISSIONER HOLLOWAY: Second. 4 DIRECTOR MARKS: Mr. Chairman, 5 on a motion to approve 2008-037-SP made by 6 Commissioner Munoz and seconded by 7 Commissioner Holloway, Commissioner 8 Arencibia? 9 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: Aye. 10 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 11 Bettinger? 12 COMMISSIONER BETTINGER: Aye. 13 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 14 Choffo? 15 COMMISSIONER CHOFFO: Aye. 16 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 17 DiDomenico? 18 COMMISSIONER DIDOMENICO: Aye. 19 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 20 Holloway? 21 COMMISSIONER HOLLOWAY: Aye. 22 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 23 Mehta? 24 COMMISSIONER MEHTA: Aye. 25 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 252 1 Munoz? 2 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: Aye. 3 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 4 Ng? 5 COMMISSIONER NG: Aye. 6 DIRECTOR MARKS: Chairman 7 Fitzgibbons? 8 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Aye. 9 DIRECTOR MARKS: Mr. Chairman, 10 the motion passed. 11 MR. ERCOLANO: Thank you. 12 DIRECTOR MARKS: Mr. Chairman, 13 the next application scheduled for public 14 hearing is 2008-040-SD, Classic Builders, LLC, 15 located at 416, 418, 420 Bergen Avenue which 16 is Block 1958, Lots 25A, 27A, 27B and 29A in 17 the City of Jersey City. 18 MR. HARRINGTON: Good evening 19 Mr. Chairman, Commissioners. 20 For the record, Charles 21 Harrington of Connell Foley on behalf of the 22 applicant. 23 This is a pretty straightforward 24 application. It is your typical subdivision 25 that is classified as a minor subdivision from 253 1 the Jersey City Planning Board, but we are 2 creating three lots out of four lots, so 3 Jersey City -- under their regulations that is 4 a minor subdivision, but under the county 5 regulations when you create three lots it is 6 considered a major subdivision. 7 This process does not abut a 8 county road, doesn't affect any county 9 drainage, but because it is classified as a 10 major I am required to come here tonight and 11 make presentation to the Board. 12 The property is located at 13 Bergen Avenue at, close to the intersection 14 with Union Street. 15 It was approved by the Jersey 16 City Planning Board at their meeting in March 17 in connection with the subdivision. Approval 18 was also approved for a three-family dwelling 19 on each of the lots. 20 That is pretty much it in a 21 nutshell. 22 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: We don't 23 really have jurisdiction. 24 DIRECTOR MARKS: All 25 subdivisions come to the County Planning Board 254 1 for review and approval, so the application, 2 Mr. Arencibia is correct, does not appear to 3 affect county roads or directly impact county 4 drainage facilities and the Board should 5 accept it. 6 COMMISSIONER HOLLOWAY: Motion 7 to approve. 8 COMMISSIONER MEHTA: Second. 9 DIRECTOR MARKS: Mr. Chairman, 10 on a motion to approve application 2008-040-SD 11 made by Commissioner Holloway, seconded by 12 Commissioner Mehta, Commissioner Arencibia? 13 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: Aye. 14 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 15 Bettinger? 16 COMMISSIONER BETTINGER: Aye. 17 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 18 Choffo? 19 COMMISSIONER CHOFFO: Aye. 20 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 21 DiDomenico? 22 COMMISSIONER DIDOMENICO: Aye. 23 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 24 Holloway? 25 COMMISSIONER HOLLOWAY: Aye. 255 1 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 2 Mehta? 3 COMMISSIONER MEHTA: Aye. 4 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 5 Munoz? 6 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: Aye. 7 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 8 Ng? 9 COMMISSIONER NG: Aye. 10 DIRECTOR MARKS: Chairman 11 Fitzgibbons? 12 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Aye. 13 DIRECTOR MARKS: Mr. Chairman, 14 the motion passes. 15 MR. HARRINGTON: Thank you. 16 DIRECTOR MARKS: Mr. Chairman, 17 the last application scheduled for public 18 hearing is 20008-041-SP, Robert Braha, 19 applicant, located at 2873 John F. Kennedy 20 Boulevard which is Block 1863, Lot 22 in the 21 City of Jersey City. 22 MR. SCANDARIATO: Good evening. 23 My name is Peter Scandariato, attorney for the 24 applicant this evening. 25 This is what I hope you will all 256 1 agree is a fairly simple, straightforward 2 application. 3 We are required to apply for 4 site plan approval to permit the renovation of 5 an existing commercial building at Kennedy 6 Boulevard in Jersey City. 7 There is right now existing a 8 two-story commercial building on that property 9 and McDonald's Corporation proposes to 10 renovate and occupy the first floor and 11 utilize the basement for storage and 12 refrigeration. 13 In order to do the renovations 14 we are required to upgrade the utility 15 servicing in the building. That is going to 16 require street openings on Kennedy Boulevard. 17 This project was approved by the 18 City of Jersey City in October and we are here 19 this evening to seek County Planning Board 20 approval. 21 Also seeking authorization from 22 the county to permit three sign encroachments 23 which I advise you presently exist and that we 24 won't be increasing the encroachment in any 25 way. 257 1 I have Mr. Jizeppe Anzalone who 2 is the project engineer, project architect, 3 who can give the Board an outline of the 4 proposed improvements and why we are here this 5 evening. 6 ATTORNEY CALVANICO: State your 7 name and spell your last name, please. 8 MR. ANZALONE: Jizeppe Anzalone, 9 J-I-Z-E-P-P-E- A-N-Z-A-L-O-N-E, registered 10 architect in the State of New Jersey. 11 MR. SCANDARIATO: Would you give 12 the Board please the benefit of your 13 educational background and professional 14 background? 15 MR. ANZALONE: I graduated Pratt 16 institute in 1990. I have been in the field 17 since 1988, I have been a registered architect 18 since 1994. 19 Also been to several boards, 20 West New York, New Jersey, Long Branch, as 21 well as many others in New York State. 22 MR. SCANDARIATO: I would offer 23 Mr. Anzalone as an expert in the field of 24 architecture. 25 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Yes. 258 1 MR. SCANDARIATO: Mr. Anzalone, 2 you prepared the architectural plans that we 3 gave to the Board, is that correct? 4 MR. ANZALONE: Yes. 5 MR. SCANDARIATO: These are a 6 copy of those plans? 7 MR. ANZALONE: Yes. 8 MR. SCANDARIATO: Mark those as 9 A-1. 10 Would you please describe to the 11 Board what the proposed improvements of the 12 property are. 13 (So marked.) 14 MR. ANZALONE: The improvements 15 pretty much are as stated, taking the existing 16 two-story commercial building and converting 17 it to a McDonald's on the ground floor to be 18 used for seating and kitchen area, basement to 19 be used as storage for the most part, but not 20 entirely. 21 There is a second floor 22 currently that is not being used, and so we 23 also have no plans in utilizing that second 24 floor. 25 In actuality, we are also asking 259 1 for site plan approval even though there is no 2 change in bulk in any way, shape or form on 3 this project, so it is really site plan 4 approval for the street opening and for the 5 signage. 6 The new sign being proposed 7 which we do have a rendering of, is -- will 8 not be increasing any further than the 9 previously existing sign that is already in 10 existence. 11 We would also be repairing the 12 facade of the building. As you know, there is 13 a lot of stucco on the building that is not in 14 good shape, and we are concerned it might 15 start to come down and injure people. So we 16 will be erecting scaffolding to make those 17 repairs. 18 MR. SCANDARIATO: Can you 19 describe the upgrades that you propose to make 20 to the utility system servicing the building 21 and the nature of the street openings and 22 typing, et cetera. 23 MR. ANZALONE: We are bringing 24 in a new sprinkler line. The building is 25 currently not sprinkled and the sprinkler 260 1 system has been approved by Jersey City. 2 As a matter of fact, all this 3 work has already been approved by Jersey City. 4 The MUA approved it and we are 5 also bringing in a new electrical service into 6 the building. 7 MR. SCANDARIATO: Other than the 8 fact you are required to open up the street in 9 order to upgrade those utilities, do you 10 foresee this project having any adverse impact 11 on the county road or drainage facilities? 12 MR. ANZALONE: No, I do not. 13 MR. SCANDARIATO: You are not 14 changing drainage in any way? 15 MR. ANZALONE: No. The roof 16 area isn't changing, the roof is being 17 retained so there is no increase in the storm 18 water or otherwise. 19 MR. SCANDARIATO: I don't have 20 anything further of Mr. Anzalone. 21 Unless the Board has any 22 questions? 23 DIRECTOR MARKS: Mr. Chairman, 24 can Mr. Anzalone describe how deliveries will 25 be made. 261 1 MR. ANZALONE: The building has 2 access to JFK Boulevard as well as a rear 3 alley so we intend on using the rear alley for 4 deliveries. 5 DIRECTOR MARKS: Mr. Chairman, 6 how does McDonald's Corporation make 7 deliveries, what kind of vehicles? 8 MR. SCANDARIATO: We have a 9 gentleman from McDonald Corporation, one of 10 them. 11 Why don't we swear him in. 12 MR. KLESS: Joe Kless, 13 K-L-E-S-S. McDonald's Corporation. 14 (Mr. Kless was duly sworn.) 15 MR. KLESS: In regard to 16 deliveries, McDonald's has a lot of different 17 vehicles. There are actually smaller trucks 18 that can be used. 19 Typically we are using a cage 20 system, a cage gets rolled right into the 21 store. We are trying to make deliveries a lot 22 quicker. 23 If the front of the store had to 24 be used, we could do that, but the rear seemed 25 like it was the best spot to take in the 262 1 deliveries. 2 DIRECTOR MARKS: Just one more 3 question, Mr. Chairman. Sorry if I missed it. 4 What kind of vehicles do you 5 use? 6 MR. SCANDARIATO: We have 7 tractor trailer trucks that would make the 8 deliveries. 9 When they get to the job site 10 there is actually a cage that the foot is put 11 on, a cage gets wheeled into the store, so the 12 rear alley, we thought, would be the best 13 access to get down to the storage area. 14 DIRECTOR MARKS: Mr. Chairman, 15 there just a concern about the deliveries. It 16 is not technically a county issue, but it 17 does, since it is on Kennedy Boulevard, the 18 Board has jurisdiction. 19 The street immediately behind 20 this is I believe Magnolia Avenue. 21 MR. KLESS: Correct. 22 DIRECTOR MARKS: Which is very 23 narrow and it is a concern about 18 wheeler 24 tractor trailers being able to use that. 25 MR. KLESS: The McDonald's has 263 1 different trucks they could use. Typically 2 you would use a big Mac truck, but this would 3 be a very small truck. 4 MR. ANZALONE: If I could add, 5 the alley actually extends to Journal Square 6 so we wouldn't be bringing large trucks from 7 Magnolia to make deliveries. 8 Probably be coming through the 9 Journal Square side of the -- Magnolia is a 10 small street, trucks wouldn't be able to make 11 a turn around. 12 DIRECTOR MARKS: Mr. Chairman, 13 it will be smaller trucks? What kind of 14 trucks would be making deliveries? 15 MR. KLESS: More of a box truck 16 style, more like 12 foot. 17 Each restaurant has different 18 requirements. You see the big Mac trucks? 19 That one be something we would be using here. 20 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: Again, 21 the loading will be taking place off of 22 Magnolia Avenue? 23 MR. KLESS: I don't believe that 24 is what we are planning to do. We are coming 25 off of Journal Square. There is an alleyway 264 1 off of Journal Square. We could quickly park 2 the truck. 3 Again, the truck has a cage 4 inside of it with prepacked food that rolls 5 off very quickly. 6 We wheel down the alleyway into 7 the back of the restaurant. 8 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: But 9 this is JFK Boulevard, it is a very busy 10 street. Parking is always taken up. There is 11 no place to park. 12 MR. KLESS: We typically try to 13 work with the communities in regard to early 14 deliveries, late deliveries, whatever would 15 work for the business. We couldn't stop 16 deliveries in the middle of the day. 17 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: Is this 18 McDonald's 24 hours a day? 19 MR. KLESS: The company has a 20 plan to open all restaurant 24 hours a day. 21 It depends on the sales of the restaurant. If 22 there weren't sales, we wouldn't. 23 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: I am 24 concerned about the unloading, because you are 25 on the turn on Kennedy Boulevard going 265 1 southbound and there is no possibility to 2 double park along there. 3 MR. ANZALONE: There are metered 4 spaces directly on JFK Boulevard in front of 5 the store, so if the deliveries were made at 6 an appropriate time, the trucks could utilize 7 those spaces. 8 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: Good 9 luck finding it. It is tough to find any 10 parking. 11 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: 12 Coordinate your deliveries with the Jersey 13 City Parking Authority and you could probably 14 bag those meters. That is what you do in 15 Hoboken. 16 A big delivery, you bag a 17 certain amount of spots just for a period of 18 time. They don't do it all day, you got to be 19 there at a certain time. 20 MR. KLESS: Deliveries come once 21 every four days, so this wouldn't be happening 22 every day. But again that is a great 23 suggestion. We would be more than happy to do 24 that. 25 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: What we 266 1 don't want to see is McDonald's delivery 2 trucks double parking. 3 COMMISSIONER BETTINGER: 4 Shouldn't all the deliveries be in the rear of 5 the building? 6 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: You 7 could still do deliveries from the rear of the 8 building through that alley, right? 9 MR. KLESS: Right. I think a 10 small truck would certainly work. 11 COMMISSIONER HOLLOWAY: Mr. 12 Chairman, with a small truck would you be able 13 to turn around in the alley to get out? 14 MR. ANZALONE: I will pass this 15 plan around. There is an alley but it 16 connects to a street. 17 The alley is too small. You 18 can't put a truck, but Magnolia you could put 19 a small truck. But you have the opportunity 20 of making deliveries from the Journal Square 21 side because the alley goes through. 22 I will pass this around. 23 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: But 24 Journal square is a continuation of Kennedy 25 Boulevard. 267 1 There are meters there and 2 Jersey City Police substation there and that 3 is always taken up with parking. 4 I think you are probably going 5 to go off of Magnolia Avenue with small trucks 6 and bring a dolly with your supplies through 7 the alley. 8 MR. KLESS: Again, the cage that 9 would come off the truck makes for quick 10 deliveries. 11 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: So it 12 makes sense to do that off of Magnolia Avenue 13 and go your 50 feet along that alley. 14 COMMISSIONER BETTINGER: Mr. 15 Chairman, we have a photo here that states 16 parking with theater permits only. 17 If you are going to be making a 18 delivery in the rear of the building I would 19 ask you to discuss it with the Lowe's Theater. 20 Do you plan on parking in that 21 alley, that is the question. 22 MR. KLESS: No. 23 MR. ANZALONE: Absolutely not. 24 MR. SCANDARIATO: The alley 25 would be to wheel that cage? 268 1 MR. ANZALONE: It is kind of a 2 right of way even if there are no cars over 3 there. 4 COMMISSIONER CHOFFO: Are you 5 stating if a delivery does take place on 6 Magnolia, there will not be an 18 wheeler 7 going down Magnolia Avenue? 8 MR. KLESS: I could make that 9 statement, yes. 10 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: The 11 only other thing you need a permit for is the 12 road opening from the county engineer for the 13 scaffolding as well. 14 MR. ANZALONE: We actually have 15 all the permits from Jersey City, so all that 16 is left is your approval so we can start the 17 work. 18 COMMISSIONER HOLLOWAY: Just for 19 the record, I would suggest if you are going 20 to use an 18 wheeler, to park it on Kennedy 21 Boulevard before you get to your store because 22 that is a blind side around the corner where 23 the alley is. 24 MR. ANZALONE: The meters start 25 very close to in front of our store. If the 269 1 timing is appropriate, you could use those 2 spaces early in the morning or late in the day 3 with very little impact. 4 COMMISSIONER BETTINGER: Will 5 there be tables to eat in this McDonald's? 6 MR. KLESS: Tables? About 84 7 seats. 8 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: Mr. 9 Chairman, in the application they were 10 mentioning about the signage and can you 11 explain more about the sign and whether the 12 sign will be hanging outside on the county 13 right of way. 14 MR. ANZALONE: It was just 15 removed, but there currently is a large blade 16 sign that is being replaced. 17 The new sign would be 18 illuminated similar to the old sign, so -- am 19 I answering your question? 20 COMMISSIONER MEHTA: Would it 21 then be hanging out in the right of way? 22 MR. ANZALONE: In the right of 23 way? The right of way, it extends as far as 24 the old one but not further. 25 DIRECTOR MARKS: I believe they 270 1 need to -- in a letter dated April 4, number 2 four, they will need approval for the 3 encroachment within the county right of way. 4 They will need a franchise 5 agreement or license from the Board of Chosen 6 Freeholders. 7 MR. SCANDARIATO: We are aware 8 of theaters and we have approval from Jersey 9 City as well already. 10 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Anybody 11 else? 12 ATTORNEY CALVANICO: Mr. 13 Chairman, before we make a motion I want to be 14 clear as to what we are doing with the 15 delivery so I can put it in the resolution 16 appropriately. 17 MR. ANZALONE: Delivery-wise we 18 have several options because of the uniqueness 19 of the space. 20 We have a front door so we can 21 take off from JFK Boulevard, we can take it 22 off the side of Journal Square because the 23 alley does connect that, and we have the 24 option of doing small trucks going down to 25 Magnolia. 271 1 So we have quite a bit of 2 flexibility. I am sure somehow we can make 3 this work. 4 COMMISSIONER BETTINGER: I think 5 that the Board should stipulate they cannot be 6 in peak hours delivering on Kennedy Boulevard. 7 It is important that we put that in there. 8 COMMISSIONER MUNOZ: Do we have 9 the jurisdiction to do that? 10 MR. KLESS: Usually the 11 deliveries are in the morning before peak 12 hours. We can agree to that. 13 COMMISSIONER HOLLOWAY: We have 14 jurisdiction. 15 MR. SCANDARIATO: Certainly we 16 can stipulate there will be no 18 wheelers 17 accessing the site on Magnolia. 18 COMMISSIONER HOLLOWAY: Don't 19 think you want to get the Jersey City Parking 20 Authority upset. 21 MR. SCANDARIATO: We don't want 22 to get anybody upset. 23 COMMISSIONER BETTINGER: What is 24 the schedule for doing the work? 25 MR. KLESS: We are trying for 272 1 some time late June, early July for opening. 2 DIRECTOR MARKS: Mr. Chairman, 3 can they describe where the nearest loading 4 area is along Kennedy Boulevard? 5 MR. ANZALONE: I would say 6 it is probably the closest that would be 7 feasible again would be about 75, 80 feet 8 north of the intersection of JFK Boulevard -- 9 I am sorry, you are saying for JFK Boulevard 10 deliveries? 11 DIRECTOR MARKS: Yes. 12 MR. ANZALONE: Utilizing the 13 existing meter areas in front of the store. 14 DIRECTOR MARKS: But there are 15 no loading zones. 16 MR. ANZALONE: No. 17 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: All the 18 merchants have the same issue for loading. 19 MR. ANZALONE: There is a 20 loading area west about 150 feet or so left. 21 There is a section that is not useable. 22 It is not metered parking, so I 23 assume that is for deliveries. 24 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: I think 25 there is a mid block crosswalk there that you 273 1 are thinking of. Twenty-five feet on either 2 side you are not allowed to park, so you can't 3 use that. 4 CHAIRMAN FITZGIBBONS: Any other 5 questions? 6 Do we have a motion? 7 COMMISSIONER DiDOMENICO: Motion 8 to accept. 9 COMMISSIONER CHOFFO: Second. 10 DIRECTOR MARKS: Mr. Chairman, 11 on a motion to accept application 2008-041-SP 12 made by Commissioner DiDomenico and seconded 13 by Commissioner Choffo, Commissioner 14 Arencibia? 15 COMMISSIONER ARENCIBIA: Aye. 16 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 17 Bettinger? 18 COMMISSIONER BETTINGER: Aye. 19 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 20 Choffo? 21 COMMISSIONER CHOFFO: Aye. 22 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 23 DiDomenico? 24 COMMISSIONER DIDOMENICO: Aye. 25 DIRECTOR MARKS: Commissioner 274 1 Holloway? 2 COMMISSIONER HOLLOWAY: Aye.